Ryan Burge

Absolutely.

And what keeps us in the pew then, right?

If our belief begins to wane in the literal resurrection of Jesus Christ, what keeps us going?

I think it's that social aspect of like, we expect you to be there.

We would like you to be there.

You're a valuable member of our community if you're there.

You're raising kids.

Exactly.

You've got to take them to church, right?

Yeah.

You need both and, right?

I don't think there's a huge number of people who go to church every Sunday who literally believe in none of it.

Right.

I think a lot of people show up and go, I hope I believe or or some days I believe.

Lord, help my unbelief.

I just think there's a certain number of people who are drawn to certainty, and there are certain people who are repelled from certainty.

And what does church look like for that second group, those doubtful people versus those certain people?

The mainline's always been the refuge of the doubters, right, who try their best to believe these things but just can't get over the hump sometimes.

And if that goes away—

If you're Protestant, your only option is the evangelical pastor who pounds the pulpit and says, if you don't believe what we believe, you're going to hell.