Tahlia Isaac

And just...

Yeah.

And you also have seen Orange is the New Black and Wentworth.

You know, and this hyper overzealous kind of storytelling from movies that are so –

sensationalized and that's all your reference point is.

And also my dad only knew a men's prison.

It's like that's his reference point.

I'm going into a different place.

And so I kept to myself and I just observed and just was smart about it.

And ultimately I was probably hypervigilant and overvigilant about how I showed up, but

And whether that was right or wrong, I don't know, but it was, you know, it worked out well for me because I never got myself in any trouble.

And there was, I've seen a couple of fights in prison, but over and above what I experienced was like this real sense of community in there.

Like, yeah, I mean, like, yeah, like you said, like, mums are being taken away from their kids.

You've got mums crying at night.

You know, you're locked down so then you can't call your kids because there's no access to the phones or the phone line's too long or you don't have cash to put on your phone to call your kids.

Like, it's really sad.

And then there's also lots of women who are really angry and they've had institutional contact since they were kids.

You know, and they hate being in prison and hate the system and hate the way that they're treated and they're constantly pushing back against it and being punished for that pushback.

And there's that pain.

And then, you know, there's women trying to self-medicate in there and –