Terry Gross

Right, because people refriend it.

They feel like the AI really likes their company.

Well, if artificial intelligence or any form of it, including chatbots, did have consciousness, what would the ethical implications be?

I mean, you raised the question, would we feel like we were enslaving chatbots because they actually had consciousness, that we were enslaving them to do our bidding and to flatter us?

So if a form of artificial intelligence had consciousness, it wouldn't necessarily have a conscience.

And that's a scary thing to think about.

So you tried several experiments along the way to your path in trying to understand what is consciousness and can we replicate it, for instance, in artificial intelligence.

You tried a beeper experiment to try to understand how the mind works and how thought, which is so connected to consciousness, is created.

Explain the beeper experiment.

Could I interrupt you, though?

If you're practicing like being in the moment, you know, and not being outside of what you're doing, your thought is going to be something like forgot the pepper.

So let's talk for a moment about the wandering mind and how it can lead to new ideas and creative thinking.

Over the years at NPR's Fresh Air, we've gotten to talk with a lot of great filmmakers.

Now we've made a playlist of some of our favorites, including Martin Scorsese, Steven Spielberg, Ava DuVernay, Mel Brooks, Spike Lee, Werner Herzog, and others.

Find all our new playlists and more at Fresh Air Plus at plus.npr.org slash freshair.

This is Fresh Air.

I'm Terry Gross.

Our guest today is the Syrian photojournalist Lubna Murai.

She first joined the Syrian revolution as an act of rebellion against her father.

Before we meet her, it's my pleasure to introduce our guest interviewer, Arthi Shahani.