Tom Friedman

I think the world we're going into, the ecosystem to thrive, is going to be robots, electric batteries, artificial intelligence, EVs, electric vehicles, and autonomous driving cars. That ecosystem will be the flywheel that's going to drive everything. And therefore, to me as an American...

I think the world we're going into, the ecosystem to thrive, is going to be robots, electric batteries, artificial intelligence, EVs, electric vehicles, and autonomous driving cars. That ecosystem will be the flywheel that's going to drive everything. And therefore, to me as an American...

It's essential that we play in that ecosystem and that we be able to compete head-to-head with China in that ecosystem. So that's how I'm coming at this problem. I'm not even thinking about Taiwan. I'm not thinking about communism or capitalism. I quoted a Trump official a while back who said China's goal in the world is to spread authoritarian Marxism. Oh my God.

It's essential that we play in that ecosystem and that we be able to compete head-to-head with China in that ecosystem. So that's how I'm coming at this problem. I'm not even thinking about Taiwan. I'm not thinking about communism or capitalism. I quoted a Trump official a while back who said China's goal in the world is to spread authoritarian Marxism. Oh my God.

China's got a lot of goals in the world, Ezra, but one of them is not spreading authoritarian Marxism, okay? They're trying to spread Muskism, not Marxism. That's the game they're trying to beat us at. They're trying to beat us at our game, not Karl Marx's game. And we need to understand that and be serious about it. And the last thing I'd say, given those are the industries we need to be in,

China's got a lot of goals in the world, Ezra, but one of them is not spreading authoritarian Marxism, okay? They're trying to spread Muskism, not Marxism. That's the game they're trying to beat us at. They're trying to beat us at our game, not Karl Marx's game. And we need to understand that and be serious about it. And the last thing I'd say, given those are the industries we need to be in,

This China thing, this country, you can love them or hate them. And believe me, I do both every day. But these are serious people, okay? They're not messing around like you've just seen Donald Trump mess around for the last week. And they don't hire knuckleheads and put them into key positions for the most part. OK, so those are all the biases I'm coming to this story with.

This China thing, this country, you can love them or hate them. And believe me, I do both every day. But these are serious people, okay? They're not messing around like you've just seen Donald Trump mess around for the last week. And they don't hire knuckleheads and put them into key positions for the most part. OK, so those are all the biases I'm coming to this story with.

Then I walk into the Washington debate, you know, and it's are you a panda hugger? Are you not a panda hugger? Did you say something nice about China or not nice about China? And. I just, I run away with my hair on fire because it's just not about the world I see us going into. A world I want America to thrive in and a world where I think to thrive, we need to be serious about these issues.

Then I walk into the Washington debate, you know, and it's are you a panda hugger? Are you not a panda hugger? Did you say something nice about China or not nice about China? And. I just, I run away with my hair on fire because it's just not about the world I see us going into. A world I want America to thrive in and a world where I think to thrive, we need to be serious about these issues.

Well, I would say I only can speak for myself. I actually supported Trump's tariffs the first time around. In fact, I wrote a column saying Donald Trump is not the American president Americans deserve, but he is the American president China deserve. Mm-hmm. Somebody had to call the game. So I have a lot of sympathy with that view at one level.

Well, I would say I only can speak for myself. I actually supported Trump's tariffs the first time around. In fact, I wrote a column saying Donald Trump is not the American president Americans deserve, but he is the American president China deserve. Mm-hmm. Somebody had to call the game. So I have a lot of sympathy with that view at one level.

And the other thing I would say, Ezra, I will confess something here on your show. Whether I'm writing about China from Washington or whether I'm writing about China from China, I'm always just writing about America. My goal is to use China as my permanent Sputnik, helping people understand what a formidable engine this is, however they got there.

And the other thing I would say, Ezra, I will confess something here on your show. Whether I'm writing about China from Washington or whether I'm writing about China from China, I'm always just writing about America. My goal is to use China as my permanent Sputnik, helping people understand what a formidable engine this is, however they got there.

And that if we aren't serious, then we're going to get steamrolled.

And that if we aren't serious, then we're going to get steamrolled.

It's a question I ask every trip and did on this one as well. And the answer is a combination of things, partly culture and partly just not understanding how the systems work. As a general rule, not in every case, but as a general rule, if you have an idea to start a company, there's actually not a lot standing in your way. The government's not going to interfere with that.

It's a question I ask every trip and did on this one as well. And the answer is a combination of things, partly culture and partly just not understanding how the systems work. As a general rule, not in every case, but as a general rule, if you have an idea to start a company, there's actually not a lot standing in your way. The government's not going to interfere with that.

In fact, it may help you far more than any local or state or national government would do here. If you want to write an op-ed piece condemning Xi Jinping, that'll be the last op-ed piece you write. So those two things are very decoupled there. Not only that, China has a Mandarin tradition, going back a long way.

In fact, it may help you far more than any local or state or national government would do here. If you want to write an op-ed piece condemning Xi Jinping, that'll be the last op-ed piece you write. So those two things are very decoupled there. Not only that, China has a Mandarin tradition, going back a long way.