Werner Spitzfaden

And as we did this hierarchy and then asked Rhonda to imagine herself actually doing the drive, so we begin to move into imaginal or cognitive exposure, right, is that she's imagining herself behind the wheel. And these were all very high scores, right? And then there were two or three additional imaginal exposures.

And as we did this hierarchy and then asked Rhonda to imagine herself actually doing the drive, so we begin to move into imaginal or cognitive exposure, right, is that she's imagining herself behind the wheel. And these were all very high scores, right? And then there were two or three additional imaginal exposures.

And all of a sudden, by the third one, and this was also pivotal in my mind because I believed we were heading in the right direction about what she was telling herself during the drives. And her scores came down to 10%, 15%. The scores that she had at 100% were now at 35, 25, 45. So this was another way of measurement.

And all of a sudden, by the third one, and this was also pivotal in my mind because I believed we were heading in the right direction about what she was telling herself during the drives. And her scores came down to 10%, 15%. The scores that she had at 100% were now at 35, 25, 45. So this was another way of measurement.

We also, of course, did the brief mood surveys and the evaluation of therapy after each session. And before each session. And so now we're testing our anxiety hierarchy to see if we're having an impact with the treatment.

We also, of course, did the brief mood surveys and the evaluation of therapy after each session. And before each session. And so now we're testing our anxiety hierarchy to see if we're having an impact with the treatment.

The other part of the treatment that I thought was important is that we really began to focus on breathing exercises and grounding in the moment rather than getting stuck into fortune telling. And that was, I think, tremendously helpful with staying in the moment. Would you agree with that, Rhonda? Yes. Yeah. And so once we got done with that.

The other part of the treatment that I thought was important is that we really began to focus on breathing exercises and grounding in the moment rather than getting stuck into fortune telling. And that was, I think, tremendously helpful with staying in the moment. Would you agree with that, Rhonda? Yes. Yeah. And so once we got done with that.

No, we actually did. We just started with three series of imaginal exposure. And then Rhonda actually did some individual driving, but not that particular drive, if I remember correctly. Well, I knew you were coming.

No, we actually did. We just started with three series of imaginal exposure. And then Rhonda actually did some individual driving, but not that particular drive, if I remember correctly. Well, I knew you were coming.

Yeah, and you're bringing out a couple of the names.

Yeah, and you're bringing out a couple of the names.

Yeah, and there were a couple of other parts that you mentioned, Ron, that are really important about your heart pounding and being afraid of having a heart attack. And you developed some positive thoughts around that, that, you know, I'm healthy. And just because my heart rate is up doesn't mean I'm going to have a heart attack, right? So that you're able to challenge that negative thought.

Yeah, and there were a couple of other parts that you mentioned, Ron, that are really important about your heart pounding and being afraid of having a heart attack. And you developed some positive thoughts around that, that, you know, I'm healthy. And just because my heart rate is up doesn't mean I'm going to have a heart attack, right? So that you're able to challenge that negative thought.

And I think that that was really important there. And that the other is the reality that we can't get rid of all of our anxiety. Anxiety is an incredibly functional part of our lives. And to have that expectation to be rid of all of our anxiety is totally unrealistic, right? Right. And you were able to message that to yourself as well. So that's a super important part of this.

And I think that that was really important there. And that the other is the reality that we can't get rid of all of our anxiety. Anxiety is an incredibly functional part of our lives. And to have that expectation to be rid of all of our anxiety is totally unrealistic, right? Right. And you were able to message that to yourself as well. So that's a super important part of this.

Yeah, so there's another book, Taming the Amygdala, which is a book that I've really come to like a lot. And they talk about the two ways, two or three ways of really allowing our bodies to not get to a place where we're – Well, some people dissociate when they're having that level of anxiety or they really struggle with it.

Yeah, so there's another book, Taming the Amygdala, which is a book that I've really come to like a lot. And they talk about the two ways, two or three ways of really allowing our bodies to not get to a place where we're – Well, some people dissociate when they're having that level of anxiety or they really struggle with it.

But to just allow yourself to breathe in a controlled fashion rather than hyperventilating or under breathing and restricting your breathing, which a lot of people do, that you actually engage in a very conscious breath work and much like you might if you're

But to just allow yourself to breathe in a controlled fashion rather than hyperventilating or under breathing and restricting your breathing, which a lot of people do, that you actually engage in a very conscious breath work and much like you might if you're