All-In with Chamath, Jason, Sacks & Friedberg
Iran's Breaking Point, Trump's Greenland Acquisition, Solving Energy Costs, Billionaire Tax Backlash
17 Jan 2026
Chapter 1: What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
All right, everybody, welcome back to the number one podcast in the world, your favorite podcast, the all-in podcast. With me again, the core four, the original four, David Friedberg, Jamath Palihapitiya, David Sachs, we're here, and there's a lot going on in the world. Gentlemen, how's everybody's week going? Anybody got big plans for next week?
Chapter 2: What is the breaking point for Iran's regime?
J. Cal, your ship has finally come in. Your invitation was not lost in the mail. What? Really? You have been invited to Davos.
I got to get my guitar. Oh, Davos, Kumbaya. Don't blow it now.
I'm going to bring my guitar. Don't blow it now.
Chapter 3: How is Microsoft addressing energy costs for data centers?
Don't blow it. Explain to the audience what's happening here, Sax. What's happening?
Well, as it turns out, one of the houses there is in need of content. So they've offered all in a stage to interview people.
All right. So we got stage, microphone. You're going. I'm going, yeah. President Trump is giving a major talk there on Wednesday, I understand. And so there is a stage and microphones. So I'm I canceled my ski trip in Japan to go to Davos.
Even Jason. Even J-Cal.
Even J-Cal is at Davos. Even J-Cal. I mean, it's pretty funny.
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Chapter 4: What is the significance of OpenAI's deal with Cerebras?
I was invited to be part of that. Like, you probably got this too, Chamath, back in the day. Like, they're young leaders for $50,000 a year. So, we're going to be doing some interviews.
Chapter 5: What are the implications of the billionaire tax backlash in California?
And if you want to be interviewed by me and or Sax at the USA House, email Jason at allin.com if you're there. If you have ideas for speakers and we're going to be booking in real time.
I haven't been to Davos. I guess the way it works is there's a bunch of houses. So countries have houses and then companies sponsor houses and there's stuff happening there. There's like stages set up and there's constant interviews. So, you know, I've gotten a bunch of requests. Basically everyone's interviewing everyone else at Davos. Does that make sense?
I mean, it's like all the attendees are just constantly interviewing each other.
It's like the podcast circuit. All these podcasters now have run out of guests, so they just interview each other in a giant circle.
That's what it is.
It's literally going to be... Heads of state interviewing heads of state.
Yes, everyone's just interviewing everybody.
Hey, welcome to the J.D. Vance Show. I'm J.D. Vance. With me on the show today is Mondami.
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Chapter 6: Why is Greenland's acquisition considered crucial?
Welcome to the show. Everybody's doing collabs there. The snake has eaten its tail. But I think we'll have a fun time. Me and Sax are going. And we're going to tear it up and have a good time. The USA House, I understand, is like on a main street there. And my understanding is I was talking... to the CEO of McKinsey, who's one of the partners, I guess, who sponsors a lot of the stuff at Davos.
Look at you rubbing elbows with the global elite, talking, texting with the deep state. This is fantastic.
Yeah, no, I'm going. It's a deep state. It's my deep state era going into 2026. And there's supposedly what the vibe is, Sax, is... people just kind of walk around the main town and they'll just pop into USA house and they network, have a have a coffee, they take a coffee. And then what we've got to do is have producer Lisa say, Hey, do you listen to all in a with great to see you?
Would you like to talk to David and Jason, they can be sitting over here and just me and Dave are gonna hold court. It's gonna be fun. I'm looking forward to it.
We're kind of like a little little man on the street.
We might, you know, I've done a little Vox Pop in my deck. And we might get a wireless microphone and go on the street and see what happens.
This is going to last five minutes until people hear that J. Cal is being obnoxious and asking tough questions.
Well, you know, J. Cal, people don't know this, but J. Cal does an incredible Triumph the Insult comic dog impression. Oh, yeah, I do. Oh, my God. If you went around Dallas as Triumph. Oh, dude.
Oh, yes. It looks like it's the prime minister of Germany. I understand. You turned off your nuclear at the right time. How's the data center project going? I heard the 15-year-old Greta is doing your energy conservation and your strategy. How's that going for you?
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Chapter 7: How do sanctions impact Iran's economy and protests?
That issue has also been a little bit overblown. Freiburg, you probably, or actually, you probably know a lot about that. And you can explain the data center recycling water issues and the misperceptions. And they're not, Microsoft has announced, they're not going to accept any tax breaks or electricity rate discounts. So that era seems to have ended quickly.
Shabbat, you're involved in a number of data centers and obviously David Sachs, you're involved in this as our AI czar and civil servant. So Shabbat, why don't you start us off here?
You guys can find the clip, but we talked about this a few weeks ago that these kinds of things were in the offing. I really like it. It's a very good first order set of things to do, which is to step into a local area and take all of these energy issues off the table, at least to the extent that you're contributing to it. The problem is that the data centers are only part of the problem.
The reality is that we have a whole new way of living that is drawing more and more electrons. We are at a shortage for what we need. The reaction of the utilities is to now build, which is the right reaction. The problem is that for the last 20 years, they've been underbuilding.
So as they catch up, even if you have the data centers that are willing to pay their fair share, rates will still go up. So what do we need to do that is beyond what Microsoft just announced? I think all the hyperscalers should copy what Microsoft did. I think it's great that the president was able to get these guys to the table to agree to it. What is the next major thing?
The next major thing is when you actually create $100 or $200 billion tax equity vehicle, and you have them completely subsidized and pay for the electricity costs of homeowners. How do you do that? You do that by paying for them to get solar and storage. Why would they do that? They would do that for two reasons.
Number one, and the most important, is that it will give them a social license to operate throughout the country. The second reason is that the president preserved the ability to make those kinds of investments and be tax advantaged for doing it in the one big, beautiful bill.
So if you put these two things together, I think step one is you go into a local area, you tell the local residents, we'll pay for the water. We'll make sure there's minimal noise and we'll make sure that we take absolutely no discount. We pay our fair share, even if it means paying more than you do for electricity. That's step one. But now I think we need to go in with step two.
Here is a bunch of money that we have allocated to go and fit your house out with solar, with storage, with next generation heat pumps, with a modern set of infrastructure so that you are totally resilient and now you are completely ambivalent to what the grid has to do in reaction to all the demand that's coming.
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Chapter 8: How could Greenland's status change in relation to the US?
that interfere with the ability to do co-location. Co-location is when you put a data center and the power generation next to each other, or you do them together. And Chris Wright, the Secretary of Energy, has directed FERC to make a bunch of changes to make behind the meter and co-location easier so that these data centers can stand up to their own power.
And the only reason that hasn't happened is just because of the usual bureaucratic delays, but that is well on its way to happening.
All right.
Does that make sense?
It makes total sense. And, you know, if we start thinking about incentives, incentives obviously matter. And I don't think a lot of people know this, but I think I talked about it when we were talking about nuclear free bird in France. The people who live near the vine, I think is how it's pronounced reactor. They pay 0.1% tax versus the 12% regional average.
And then I think the UK has also talked about these sort of danger zone or proposals and payments. You can give people a discount to incentivize them and reward them, giving them free local electricity, et cetera, for living near a nuclear power plant that hasn't come up here in the United States.
And there's been a lot of FUD, fear, uncertainty and doubt Freiburg around these data centers, people throwing around a lot of talking points. I think you and I discussed offline the the misperceptions about water usage and that the water usage is largely recycled in these data centers. If you know about that, would you would you inform the audience about that piece of data?
Well, we got a lot of water. It just goes around in a circle. So I don't think that's an issue.
But clean water and the cost of clean water increasing for a local population is the issue.
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