Show notes
Our part of Portugal is known as the last wild coast in Europe and it’s a beautiful place to start a podcast series on Portuguese wine.Long-distance hikers pound the Rota Vicentina Fisherman’s trail which follows more than 200km of clifftops, surfing spots and secret beaches on the country’s Atlantic west coast.And one stretch of this epic two week walk features the first winery on the list for our Big Portuguese Wine Adventure – Vicentino.The wines are fresh and fruity and instilled with the saltiness of the Atlantic Ocean which their 60 hectares of grape vines overlook.We decided to start local: Vicentino is the nearest vineyard to the place we now call home in Portugal’s Alentejo region.The Spanish might call it Allan-tay-HOE, but here in Portugal it’s Allan-tay-JOE and it’s Portugal’s biggest province covering a third of the country.As early adopters to The Big Portuguese Wine Adventure blog will know – the name comes from Alem-Tejo...Portuguese for “beyond” the Tejo, or Tagus River, on which Lisbon is situated.And we are?We travelled the world together as a diplomat and journalist couple, but one day we decided to give up our jobs and move to the Portuguese countryside – to build an eco-luxe lodge (which is almost finished!) and learn about wine.Inspired by a scraggy line of overgrown grapes that emerged from our land when we moved in, we decided to plant our own vineyard and maybe one day make our own wine...but first there was a lot of learning to do!Our house isn’t connected to any municipal water or power grid and so we also had to learn how to live off-the-grid.If you want to read how hard that’s been, Al also writes a blog called Off-Grid and Ignorant in Portugal, but given his previous job as a BBC foreign correspondent we thought making a podcast series was more in our comfort zone!We’ve spent the last couple of years exploring Alentejo’s history and geography through wine, winemakers and the stories they tell...and wanted to share our journey with you.So thanks for reading, but most importantly thanks for listening, and welcome to Episode 1!So what’s Alentejo wine?Vicentino doesn’t make wine that is typical to this region.Most Alentejo wines are grown inland – far from the moderating effect of the ocean – and are heavier, stronger and more powerful with all the heat and sunshine.Alentejo produces more than 40% of Portugal’s wines and is known for its great value, easy drinking reds, as well as some amazing white wines.But it’s also home to talha wine – made in amphorae or clay pots like the Romans did two thousand years ago...and people here have been making it that way ever since.We’ll be delving into the heart of Alentejo wine country in Episode 2 and trying some talha later in the series, but for the first instalment we’re drinking pinot noir naked and learning the connection between French grapes, cat pee and the Beatles.Salivating storytellersOur guide to Vicentino is maverick Norwegian owner Ole Martin Siem who salivates over the Chardonnay grapes gifted to him from Burgundy and talks in simple terms about taste and bouquet.We’re not wine experts, just enthusiastic amateurs, eager to demystify wine appreciation and its sometime intimidating language, and Ole Martin enthusiastically sets us off on that path.He has farmed in Alentejo since the 1980s but is relatively new to winemaking – his first grapes were planted in 2007 – but Vicentino is now one of the biggest Pinot Noir producers in Portugal and is doing something a little bit different.Touriga Nacional, Aragonez, Alvarinho and Arinto are among the 250 indigenous Portuguese grapes which are grown in Vicentino’s vineyards and we’ll learn much more about them later in the series.But international grapes including Pinot Noir, Sauvignon Blanc, Syrah and Chardonnay all do really well on this coast – as they do in regions with similar climates, latitudes and ocean influence: South Africa’s Western Cape and the Californian Central Coast.Listening and learningIn every half hour episode we learn a new skill – starting off this time at the very beginning of the growing season with pruning, and some advice about what to do with our scraggy, overgrown vines.We stop to have a “Clink and a Think” about Portuguese wine history dating back to 800BC and the Phoenicians, and hear a great story about this remarkable “green triangle” of agricultural land and why the viticulturalists have their eye on our coast.But let’s not spoil the journey! You can find The Big Portuguese Wine Adventure wherever you get your podcasts: Spotify, Apple Podcasts...you name it.I need a drinkPortuguese wine makers like to keep the best for themselves, so it’s not always easy to get hold of the wines we’ve been tasting and discovering.Obviously the best way to taste the wine is to drop by our place Vale das Estrelas (or the Valley of the Stars).Our eco-luxe lodge is opening this year and we’re stocking our cellar full of Alentejo wines.The views are outstanding, the wines are great and the stories are even better.I really need a drink...nowWhile you plan your trip to Portugal we’ll help you get hold of the wines we’re tasting wherever you are...when they’re available.It’s tough to find them in the US right now, but there are some stockists you can find in the UK through Vindependents.PODCAST SCRIPT: ANA: Hello, I’m Ana.AL: And I’m Al. HellooooANA: And welcome to Ana and Al’s Big Portuguese wine adventure!AL: We used to have proper jobs – I was a foreign correspondent, and Ana was a diplomat, but we decided to give up all the globetrotting to move here...ANA: To southwestern Portugal...AL: It’s so beautifully quiet and peaceful here...the view over the forests and the mountains is just stunning.ANA: Yeah, Alentejo is this landscape of rolling hills, cork oaks and olive trees. My dad’s family is from Alentejo, but further inland. Here we are closer to the ocean.AL: When we moved here we found those scraggy vines just over there by the fruit trees...about 20 of them...they must be pretty old...ANA: They’re on the slope at the edge of a terrace and they’re a complete mess…AL: totally overgrown with bramblesand I have no idea what kind of grapes they are.ANA: Our lovely friend Baptiste, who happens to own a real wine-estate in France kindly called these little things “A not un-managable parcel.”AL: Haha...but it did get us thinking: maybe we could plant our own grapes and make our own wine down here or up on the flat land on top of the hill.ANA: So after decades on the road we are finally putting down some rootsAL: literally as well as figuratively.ANA: But first we have so much to learn about wine – especially Portuguese wine. AL: Which is why we’re going on a big adventure to learn as much as we can.and rather than keeping it all to ourselves we thought you might like to join us!ANA: At least we know a few of the basics....AL: P is for PortANA: V is for Vinho VerdeAL: T is for Touriga Nacional, A is for Aragonez...but I’m getting ahead of myself. There are very few places in the world where you can buy such good value wine.ANA: And so many are now getting noticed around the world. Remember the wine merchant we met in California? He told us that compared to other European countries you can’t buy that quality at this price whether you want fine wine, of value-for-money vino.ANA: In each episode we’ll go to a different vineyard in Portugal, go behind the scenes, hear the maverick winemakers tell some great stories as we ask stupid questions so you don’t have to.AL: If you’re as curious about Portuguese wine as we are – with a bit of history and exploring on the side – then you’ve come to the right place! ANA: So welcome to Ana and Al’sAL: Big Portuguese Wine Adventure.ANA: Episode One.AL: Vineyard One.ANA: VicentinoAL: So…there they are…fields of dormant vines…waiting for the perfect temperature to burst into life.ANA: Vicentino vineyard is just 20 minutes from our house and it’s a great story to start us off.AL: In this episode we’ll learn the connection between French grapes, cat pee and the Beatles.ANA: We’ll try drinking pinot noir nakedAL: We will?ANA: You’ll see.AL: I hope so.ANA: Haha. I’ll develop some serious secateur envy.AL: And there’s a strong Scandinavian connection...OM: My name is Ole Martin Siam. I’m a Norwegian and I came out here for 35 years ago for the first time. I've been building up this farm which we are standing from scratch. I didn't think of wine before 2007. AL: Wow, you didn't think about wine before then?OM Well, I consumed wine, I enjoyed wine but not gave it any thought of producing wine.AL So what was the business to start with?OM Frupor is the name of the company and we are in vegetables, decorative foliage, which is leaves you never asked for, but you get when you buy flowers.OM And wine was on my desk many times but I said it's so competitive. It's so many doing it is so different from what we are doing. So I said no, no, no, no, no. Until I read that good wine is all about producing good grapes. So I said well, we are good growers. We are professional and growing. So I started reading more and found out obviously that we are in a very special terroir compared to the rest of Alentejo, because we are so close to the sea. So the temperatures are much lower in the summertime it's milder in the winter, but lower in the summertime. So I thought maybe it can be different enough to stand out in the marketplace and have a chance to do something special. The first plants were planted in 2007.AL Is that when you came in, or have you been a later addition to the business?Filipe No, actually I joined very, very recently. I'm a newcomer. Not to the region, because I've been here quite a lot of times during the years…Filipe And I'm, yeah, I'm Filipe Caetano. That's my name. I'm Portuguese. And I joined to be the head of the wine business.AL Excellent. That's good. All right. Well, let's have a little tour then. Shall we? got the keys? In the car?Filipe Okay, so we will possibly go to the first vineyard.AL: They now have 60 hectares of grapes on this flat strip of land on the edge of the world.ANA: Yeah – that’s what it feels like. The cliffs on this wild coast are rugged and steep. This vineyard is a bit of a frontier for wine making.AL: Most of Alentejo’s grapes are grown far inland where it’s super-hot in the summer – totally different from this seaside climate – which is similar to the Californian coast or parts of South Africa, ANA: And that had a lot to do with Ole Martin’s decision making. OM This is Touriga National on the left and Sav Blanc on the right.AL Why did you choose to put sav blanc in first of all?OM Because w’re close to the sea. I love Sauvignon Blanc. It's a good reason in itself. But it's also I thought it was a good grape that would thrive well here and I was proven right. I would say after these years it's our best seller. It was launched in 2015. And it went right up to the top I would say our winemaker was announced the winemaker of the year. The Michelin star restaurants all wanted it on their list. So that was a good start.AL It certainly was! (Laughs)AL Yeah. Can we jump out to talk about it?AL So this is the to Touriga National…it's an indigenous grape to Portugal.OM Touriga National is a red grape. It is very Portuguese. And it's, I would say the national grape of Portugal (on the reds). It's a bit forceful grown in the interior. It's very forceful wine. Heavy, full of all aromas. And down here at the sea we get it slightly more elegant...meaning less forceful.ANA: Ole Martin is a bit of a maverick – he comes from a big Norwegian shipping family, but took himself houw in the 1980s before Portugal joined the European Union to develop a farm.AL: And as he did then, he’s now doing something very different in terms of winemaking for Alentejo.OM: So basically, you have some Sav Blanc, going south, all the way continuous on the other side of the road. Whereas these lots here we have Touriga National, Semillion Blanc and AragonezAL: Yet another PortugueseOM Yes other Portuguese and then you have some Syrah. You have some Pinot Noir as we talked about. And you have Alvarinho which you see just across -the other Portuguese. And on top of that we have Arinto…Filipe Lately we have Chardonnay.OM Obviously Chardonnay another little story I can tell you afterwards. Pinot Noir is another non Portuguese grape. Also a wine, I I love. Now we are the biggest Pinot Noir growers in Portugal today. But the thinking here was also that we are in the cooler climates in the summertime and Pinot Noir is very picky in terms of the soil, the climate and the farmer and I fit I'll give it a lot of love and care it will not deliver.ANA: Let's take a few minutes to have a wonder. Let's check out what this area is famous for.AL: We can't just talk about wine. I mean, you need to get a feeling for the place and this beautiful stretch of coastline. Wow, isn't this amazing?ANA: It’s so gorgeous. So here it is. This is the Atlantic coast. This is what makes the Vicentino wines so special.AL: Yes, it's a beautiful stretch of coast. The idea is that every time we go to a vineyard, we're going to go for a wander and give you a bit of a sense of what it's like around and about. Paint a picture, if you like, to get a sense of the place.ANA: And here that's really, really easy. I mean, we're walking along the fisherman's trail on Rota Vicentina, which is on the Vicentino coast and stone's throw away from the vineyard.AL: Yeah, it's beautiful how the Atlantic crashes into these cliffs here. It's very dramatic.ANA: Look, this natural park is totally unspoiled; the surfers just love it here. And there's some pretty good seafood to be had.AL: Yeah, I mean, I've been dabbling with fishing but not very seriously. But you often see the fisherman perched on these steep cliffs casting from the cliffs into the ocean below.ANA: I mean, we love this coast. It's so beautiful. And even in the high season, you can find yourself a little secret beach with practically nobody else on it.AL: Yeah, I love the geology just the the way the rocks are all folded and twisted. I love to know what caused this millions of years ago.Ana This is very lovely. We're just walking through some shady trees over a path which runs next to a creek which you might be hearing in the background and yes, we're also flanked by gorgeous almost bamboo-stick canas or reeds ...AL: Boa tarde Marta. How are you? We found you. Thanks, Alastair. Hi. Nice to meet you.Marta Cabral Nice to meet you too. already recording?AL Yeah, why not?Marta Cabral Nice.AL Right, let's go there. It's lovely to have the view. This is Ana.Ana Hello. Hi. Pleased to meet you.Marta Cabral Pleased to meet you too. My name is Marta Cabral. I am the president of the association Rota Vicentina, which...manages all the trails connected to Rota Vicentina. This place was for 1000s of years, a very special, even mystical place. Because, you know, it's over 100 kilometres of wild coast. And it's really amazing. This is a big part. But for me, that's only the Instagram effect of it in the sense that there is so much more to live here, apart from the landscapes.AL Vicentino, just behind us, obviously, almost share a name with you. Tell me about that relationship.Marta Cabral Yes, so wine is an amazing asset from us Portuguese people. This area is not very traditional for local wines...people produced wines for their own house or for the neighbours, there are not many local good labels. And okay, this is one of them, so they are our partners.AL: Marta, thanks very much.ANA: Speaking of labels, I think Vicentino wines have done a stellar job of capturing the colours of this coast. All of their labels are beautifully stylized, modern, but in various shades of blue and pink depending on which time of day they represent.AL: It really is a special part of the world, isn't it?ANA: It is for us to come to and hike and walk our dogs. But for all Ole Martin it’s even more special. He's even more impressed by the land and what it has to offer.AL You said that the terroir here was particularly special. What is it about the terroir here, not just the being so close. I can see the ocean from here actually has to do with that beautiful coastline. But what is it about the land?OM How many hours do I have?AL Can you do the short version? (Laughs)OM This terroir is unique. And if you look at a Google map, and you look at Portugal, you see this green triangle...from just north of here into the mountains Monchique and then back out just north of Sagres.AL So it goes right down from here in Alentejo down to the Algarve, which is very close. And are there many other wine makers in that triangle?OM Now there isn’t. For now, I think there will be more as we go into time. However, because this has, if you go further north along the coast, you don’t have the same microclimates you have here you have what do you call it a certain wind pattern that brings in fresh airs from the ocean, and sends it in, and it goes back out, around Sagres, which cools down the summer temperature. And that’s very important. When you have 43 degrees in Beja, we will typically have around 30, maybe even less 28 degrees, which is perfect for the grapes.Filiipe The other the other possible thing is the the fog. Al: Yeah, I was gonna say the marine layer. That’s what made me think about, about California. And having that marine layer that comes in...Filipe It's quite common that we have it even during summer that we have it until 11am many days, and that’s good.AL And that’s good?Filipe It’s good for the grapes yes. This is why these grapes that were chosen, are so well implanted here, because the it’s a quite mild climate or microclimate as we were talking compared specifically to the interior of Alentejo, where you find really hot and high temperatures. And here, it allows for these specific grapes to you know, to ripe very, very slowly. And that’s, that’s very important for the final result obviously.OM This is only the first chapter of ten describing the speciality of this triangle. And this triangle is marked by manir rocks 6000 years old.ANA It’s a monolith, it looks like a gigantic tooth.OM There are quite a few – 25 or there abouts.Filipe And they actually follow more or less this triangle. AL: And the layers of Portuguese history have been piling up ever since then.The perfect chance for a clink and a think about the past...ANA: In terms of winemaking that probably started here around 800BC with the Phoenicians.AL: Then the Romans spent centuries taking it to another level with their amphorae and cultivation techniques.ANA: And the Christians that followed were big fans of wine.AL: Not so much the Moors who invaded from North Africa in 711AD.ANA: Portugal was under Islamic rule for 450 years – there are thousands of Arabic words in the Portuguese language.AL: And AL-gharb – meaning “the west” – is where the name Algarve comes from. ANA: The Christian crusaders drove the Moors out...and wine has played a pretty important role here ever since.AL: Sip & ahAL So these are the Chardonnay. You’re saying how long have you had the Chardonnay in and then obviously younger looking? OM Yes, they were planted in 2016 – 16 and 17. I’ve been sceptical on growing Chardonnay here in Portugal. My favourite wine is a good Chardonnay, and the wine I dislike the most as well, it’s the bad Chardonnay.AL When it’s really buttery and oaky…OM Yeah, you heard about the expression in the United States for instance, or asked which one do you like and they say ABC stands for Anything But Chardonnay it’s a lot of truth a lot of its oak and buttery and too much fruit and you know it’s...a little nose is sufficient. And we had we have some French friends…OM We’re friends with Henri Boulant is a I call him the Beatles in the wine world and he in fourth/fifth generation produced excellent wines and the best part of Burgundy. They convinced him to come out and visit for him you know any wine outside Burgundy is nothing and particularly Sauvignon Blanc: that’s like cat pee. As most French and in particular for a bit snobbish? Yeah, yeah. Coming out here to Portugal seeing what was going on. He got everything confirmed. This is area outside the area as you know. It’s the wildness. Yeah.He got here, and we he served him Savingnon Blanc from our own 2014 In fact, and he said this is not Savingnon Blanc. This is different. I said no, Savingnon Blanc, produced here and he said he liked it. That doesn’t mean so much to me because people are polite, and so this was a nice wine. But when you finished two bottles, I understand he liked it.AL And if he didn’t, he probably would have said?OM He is one of the guys who would have said actually. However, the following morning is that they need a digger to go and make some profiles in the ground here. So he dug up 10 different profiles down to three metres. And for each hole that he dug, his mouth goes more and more open. And he says, this is fascinating. Look at this profile, look at the soil and the geology and the mixture of rocks, etc, etc. And then he said, If you allow me, I’ll provide my plants for one hectare. And I will follow it up in seven years.AL Really?OM I mean, for me, that was like you just learn to play the guitar. And then Beatles come and says, should we make a record together? It’s amazing.AL Is this is it?OM This is this is it. This hectare here is Henro Ballon’s grapes.AL Wow, amazing.Ana That’s a fantastic story. It just gets better and better!Filipe Yeah, so Burgundy is now closer to the Atlantic! So the 19 was the first time that we had the possibility to bottle and we’re not launching it now. Because we need to see how it progresses. But the first stage things are really, really amazing.OM You should be trying some of the wines Have the enthusiasm when they talk them.AL I can sort of see your mouth visibly watering as you’re talking about your Chardonnay.OM It is.AL: So as well as learning about Portuguese wine, we’re also learning how to make the stuff.ANA: And that means planting vines, growing grapes and then looking after them.AL: So we’re not going to turn down a chance to learn about pruning.ANA: You mean how to tackle our overgrown vines.AL: Yeah – I mean when they offered to introduce us to George the pruning guy…ANA: You can’t say no – right?AL: Exactly. And you got secateur envy…didn’t you?ANA: Absolutely. I need electric secateurs...GM: So my name is George Martin's. George Martinez. I’m viticulture manager of Frupor and Vicentino. And we are now in the in the field...where we are pruning Sauvignon Blanc.AL It looks pretty brutal it must be said!GM It is it is. Basically, the way we prune will indicate the way we want the plants to grow and to produce. So we can define, let's say the architecture of the plant. We can prune the plant to produce more, and to produce less so. And because of that, as well, there's a direct linking between wine quality and production.AL So this vine this, this is Sauvignon Blanc, you say? Yeah, and it's it, it branches off from main root, which is about what's that three quarters of metre from the ground?GM Yes, more or less. So it's basically has one, one, main, one main foot...we leave the main branch of the main arm that we, we put last year, and then we just select, we just select 1,2,3,4 canes, where we cut them and we just leave these new growth areas.Ana I'm looking at all the people pruning in there working super-fast. How long does it take to prune, like a hectare?GM One hectare? Yeah. Usually if if depends of the type of pruning. What they are doing now is one of the most simple pruning systems.GM So, I think more or less, it's one day per one hectare on this system.AL: And we couldn’t pass up a chance to ask for a little advice about our...erm...parcel?ANA: But he wasn’t very impressed with your photos of the vines was he…AL So I took these the other day. Here we go that terrible colour rubbish photographs. Three of them. And they all look like this. They've got no irrigation coming into them.GM: Right. This is a bit Wild huh?AL Yeah, obviously, we've no idea what they are right? There were some grapes on them last yearGM Oh that's that will produce incredible bottles of wine.AL So we do want to plant like a third of a hectare of grapes of some description in the future. But I just thought what I should do with them. I should prune them so at least when they come up...You should - I mean at least you have you have some some grapes.AL Something to experiment with exactly how they grow. And you know, just to learn really definitely any idea what it is. GM It's difficult to understand the way it's been done in the past. Bloody hell, what a mess. This is OM’s house...beautiful isn’t it etc It’s like a paradise almost. OK. Thanks very much.OM house welcome: Hello how are you? What a gorgeous house.AL What are we tasting today? What are you what are we up to?OM We have some shellfish oysters and clams and we'll have some tambouril rice which is monkfish rice I guess in English. Therefore will serve you some roses and some white wine - that looks like a Chardonnay isn't it? Then we can have three different Pinot Noirs, in three different ways.Filipe So we have a 100% Pinot Noir, and it's a rose. So it's a very light and pale salmon, pink rose, this one aged on barrels. When the grapes arrived, they are very, very, very, very gently crushed, because we get the first what we call the first juice. And this is the one that goes into this wine. So it's very not only the grapes are chosen, almost, you know, bunch by bunch, at the winery, they really have extra care if you want on the on the pressing.OM Taste is something that we are not educated from childhood, I could point at your sweater your shirt and say exactly the colour is not blue. It's slightly turquoisey or ocean blue, you have words to describe down to the smallest detail. But we never learn that in taste. But it's the same kind of organ that you can develop and it can have words and you can recognise, and you can remember, like I will remember your shirt being ocean blue, for instance, you can remember, ah, the wine and drank five years ago had this particular taste. But it's also the way to organise the different taste in your brain. So it's as much that as actually taste.OM Educating your nose to recognise and separate different basic smells and tastes if you like. And the vocabulary is enormous. You can talk about everything from leather and earth to flower and fruit, perfume and what have you. So that's the tasting part of it. And then you have more texture, you have wines that are more fatty, more rich if you like. And then you have a third aspect, you have the acidity. That's by and large, the wine is better the more acid, even in red wines.AL And I suppose a lot of people will say, Oh, the wine tasting thing is just wine snobs, they talk about all these flowery language. But I guess we're learning it's a way of, of sharing a palette, sharing how you describe blue – how you describe a taste is is very difficult playing off what you've just said about people not knowing how to describe what that flavour is. OM That's why they say it's snobbish because they don't understand is like somebody talking about a painting. The more you know, the more you can appreciate and the more you see in that painting, and the more you like to talk and share with others as well, same thing with a glass of wine. The more you know, the more you understand, the more interesting it is to analyse it and enjoy it. And also share your opinions.AL: So on that - cheers - tell us what you can smell and what you can taste.OM Let's just smell it first. I forgot to talk about the saltiness that we have in this the first thing that comes to my nose when I put my nose into the glass, is that a fine saltiness that is very present. And then obviously I recognise that it is the Pinot Noir grape, which is the slight fruitiness of the Pinot Noir...and it triggers my nose...I would like taste right?AL Okay. Stage Two.OM And it is simply wonderful. It has this, you know, it's not short. It's not too rich. It has this fantastic balance. In particular, this one I think it's a beautifully balanced, Pinot Noir rose wine.AL Thank you very much indeed for the tour of the vineyard yesterday for this fabulous lunch and the tastings – particularly the Pinot Noirs.Ana For all of your time and all of the wonderful insights that we have gained from you. Thank you so much.ANA: And thank you so much...AL: For listening to our first podcast!ANA: If you liked it tell all your friends.AL: If you hated it don’t tell anyone.ANA: Thanks to Vicentino wines – and Ole Martin Siam in particular for hosting us, showing us around.AL: And giving us a lovely lunch with lots of wineANA: Thanks to the Rota VicentinaAL: And to all of our guestsANA: Share us, like usAL: Love us...ANA: And please listen to the next episode...where we get down to some serious businessANA: We’re heading to big, bold, Alentejo red wine countryAL: To boldly go where you might not have gone beforeANA: And to follow us on our Big Portuguese Wine Adventure...AL: Oh...you can do better than that: Our Big Portuguese Wine Adventure... Get full access to The Big Portuguese Wine Adventure at wineportugal.substack.com/subscribe