David McWilliams (on the history of money)
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What is discussed at the start of this section?
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert, experts on expert. I'm Dan Shepard and I'm joined by Lily Padman. Hi. Hi. Today we have an economist on, and this, I've been wanting to do this for a while. And I think it was maybe probably Malcolm who planted the seed, which is Malcolm Gladwell said, it is really peculiar how powerful money is in our lives.
Yes.
And how it is a forbidden topic. I know. It's like there isn't a more relevant force that we don't talk about.
I agree. It's that play for everything. Interesting.
I think because we know intuitively it leads to envy.
Yeah.
So you just avoid it to avoid envy.
Or like bragging or something. Like there are traps.
But like if you work with someone, they go, how much do you make? The issue is, well, I'm afraid to say because if I make more than them, we have issues. Yes. And if I make less than them, now I have an issue with them.
I know somebody who a few times has like, been in a group and said how much money they've made on something. Yeah. And I am like, I'm so allergic to it. Yeah.
How did David McWilliams' upbringing influence his views on money?
And I guess I don't.
And this wouldn't shock you, but I've always pretty much been very open about it. I remember Kate Hudson's brother, Oliver, who I love and was really tight with for a while. I think the first time we ever met, we were sitting in the backyard of someone's palatial house. And we're like looking at the city. It's pretty overwhelming with how gorgeous everything was. And this is 21 years ago. And I was quite a place. And he's like, yeah. And we both worked a bit as an actor. And I'm like, yeah. And then somehow, I don't know how, but He was just like, yeah, how much do you have in the bank? And I'm like, oh, I have like $400,000. He goes, oh my God, that's exactly what I have.
Oh, wow.
And I was so excited. And we like, there was something very bonding about it too. But like, yeah, I've always kind of been that way. I had to learn about it. I always had less than everyone, so it didn't matter.
Exactly.
And my family was very open about money. And a lot of families are very tight-lipped about money.
My parents would never. I would ask them, how much money do you make? Isn't that weird? They would never tell me.
My mom's approach, which I agree with, was like, hey, you got to learn how to manage all this and feed yourself. You better know what it, like, I make this.
What role does money play in our lives according to David McWilliams?
The house is this. The groceries are this. Like, you need to understand. And that is more logical to be including your kids so they leave the house with a real sense of what it all is.
I mean, they were definitely instilling, like, you need to have enough. You need to be safe. Everything costs so much money all the time. Like, they were instilling fear around it. So then I would say, like, well, how much do you make? Like, if it's everything so scary. And then they didn't want to say. That was not for us to ask.
I know, it's very, very common. What you're already detecting if you're listening still is that we had a break and now we're so excited to be back together and chatting a lot. So this was an intro that kind of became a fact check. Alas, David McWilliams' book is called The History of Money and it's absolutely fascinating. It is a force that really you don't have the luxury of ignoring because... It fuels revolution and despotic rulers, and you got to keep your eye on it. Please enjoy David McWilliams.
Europe's surprisingly close to New York.
Yeah, we really appreciate that because in our heads, America occupies a different place. Then you realize five hours is not a big deal. That's why the Vikings were able to get there. Exactly, whereas you bastards like your fucking miles away.
I know.
We're the real deal. This is like going to a different civilization for us.
For a lot of Americans, L.A. is a different civilization.
Is it not maddening if you're in the rest of the world going like, that place changes so radically every four years?
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Chapters
8 chapters
1
What is discussed at the start of this section?
0:00–1:19
2
How did David McWilliams' upbringing influence his views on money?
1:19–2:34
3
What role does money play in our lives according to David McWilliams?
2:34–4:46
4
How does David McWilliams relate fire to the history of money?
4:46–50:51
5
What challenges did American revolutionaries face with currency?
50:51–51:21
6
How did the Treaty of Versailles impact Germany's economy?
51:21–51:26
7
What role did Lenin's actions play in the Russian Revolution?
51:26–51:59
8
How does the discussion shift towards the implications of money and power?
51:59–1:36:02