Emotional Sobriety: The Next Step in Recovery

Don't Stop Before You Even Start!

19 Apr 2026

Contributed by Lukas

Thom’s Nutshell: “When you want something, do you begin with a commitment to make it happen or a list of reasons that it probably won't?" The migh...

Disappointments Are Not Obstacles

05 Apr 2026

Contributed by Lukas

Thom’s Nutshell: “Life is a wonderful blessing, with many great disappointments. Can you see disappointment as a gift?” In emotional sobriety, w...

Anger is Just Another Feeling

26 Mar 2026

Contributed by Lukas

Thom’s Nutshell: One of emotional sobriety's greatest challenges is for us to understand and accept our contribution to our own distress without bec...

Moving Forward After Relapse, Part Two

16 Mar 2026

Contributed by Lukas

Thom’s Nutshell: Rigorous honesty begins at home. Joe C. joins us to discuss the ways relapse is experienced by the loved ones of the relapser, and...

Moving Forward After Relapse, Part One

08 Mar 2026

Contributed by Lukas

Thom’s Nutshell: “You cannot work both sides of the serenity prayer. Choose. Commit.” Emotional sobriety is about moving forward. The key to un...

Adjustments at Close Range

24 Feb 2026

Contributed by Lukas

Thom’s Nutshell Wisdom: “Practice conversations to convey rather than convince.” Healthy Conversation is “present-centered.” In a healthy co...

“What You Resist Will Persist,” with John Amodeo

16 Feb 2026

Contributed by Lukas

Former guest and longtime friend John Amodeo joins Allen and Thom to advocate “gentle presence” 9 making ourselves available to the full range of ...

Whitehat Addictions

09 Feb 2026

Contributed by Lukas

Thom checks back in after a long period of freezing weather and system crash in Tennessee, Allen gets honest after recent familial struggles. What mak...

Excavating Your Lost Self

01 Feb 2026

Contributed by Lukas

Thom’s Nutshell: "How much of what you believe do you really believe?" Allen and Patrick review a recent Slate article about Emotional Sobriety and ...

"Focus Mokus" with Joe C.

27 Jan 2026

Contributed by Lukas

On clarity, which comes with emotional sobriety: an antidote to impulsivity, rumination, indecision and procrastination. Thom’s nutshell wisdom: Yo...

Personal Agency in Emotional Sobriety

19 Jan 2026

Contributed by Lukas

"I didn't have a choice." You're selling yourself short. Or you mean, the choice seemed obvious to you. But still, you made the choice. Or - you are m...

Tout Est Possible

12 Jan 2026

Contributed by Lukas

Today’s Nutshell Wisdom: The big difference between passing judgment and exercising judgment: One focuses attention on something I do not control. ...

Resilience Myths

01 Jan 2026

Contributed by Lukas

Joe C. quotes Joseph Campbell: “We must be willing to let go of the life we have planned, so as to have the life that is waiting for us.” Thom’s...

Self-Supporting Holiday

24 Dec 2025

Contributed by Lukas

For this week’s nutshell, prioritizing comfort will eventually make us very uncomfortable. We talk amends and pull some wisdom from Arthur Schopenha...

“God Doesn’t Flunk Anyone, but He Gives a Lot of Re-Tests”

14 Dec 2025

Contributed by Lukas

On learning from our mistakes. Whether or not the mistake results in an immediate change in our behavior, learning is always taking place if we can ge...

Holidays Aren’t So Bad! (Unless You Get Kicked by a Horse)

27 Nov 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Nutshell of the Day: “Even introverts need connection and support. Solitude is vital. Isolation is deadly.” On the eve of Joe C.’s sober birthda...

Your Family Is Your Alma Mater

13 Nov 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Carol Carter returns to the show as we try a more focused format and talk change, not taking things personally, and understanding our capacity to acco...

"You’re the One You’ve Been Waiting For" with Melanie Gulde

04 Nov 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Melanie Gulde returns to the podcast to talk with Allen and Thom about the progress and promise of Divided Sky in Vermont, which isn’t a rehab but a...

Codependency and Emotional Sobriety

24 Oct 2025

Contributed by Lukas

“...the pain that comes from loving someone who's in trouble can be profound.” ― Melody Beattie, Codependent No More: How to Stop Controlling ...

The Merry-Go-Round

12 Oct 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Joe, Thom, and Patrick talk Marcus Aurelius, read a daily reflection from Joe’s “Beyond Belief,” and consider the uncomfortable necessity of sta...

Emotional Sobriety & Creativity with Michael J. Harney

03 Oct 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Actor, writer and director Michael J. Harney (NYPD Blue, Deadwood, True Detective) joins Thom and Allen to talk about his evolving spirituality and jo...

The Bedroom Opens off the Living Room

12 Sep 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Joe C. joins Allen and Patrick to introduce what will be a series of episodes discussing how emotional sobriety can improve our sexual relationships, ...

Trauma is Subjective

05 Sep 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Clinical trauma specialist and author of Trauma and the 12 Steps Jamie+ Marich, Ph.D., LPCC-S, REAT joins Allen and Thom this week to talk about her b...

Beliefs Are Choices

30 Aug 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Thom, Joe, and Patrick read from the Beyond Belief daily reflections about where emotional sobriety can come in when we’re struggling to tolerate op...

Close to the Ditch

22 Aug 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Joe Chisholm returns to discuss helping others through suggestion, not “expertise.” Emotional sobriety can help us escape a “victim mentality”...

Streamline Your Thinking!

15 Aug 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Thom and Allen discuss pursuing emotional sobriety once we become aware of our “unconscious incompetence.” In practicing anything until it becomes...

"I Am Not a Counselor"

07 Aug 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Having recently celebrated 40 years of continuous sobriety, Bill Cleveland, a pillar in a multitude of recovery fellowships (namely Hermosa Beach Men’...

The Reverse Golden Rule

31 Jul 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Superfriend Carol Carter returns to talk about a recent breakthrough in self-love, a welcome reminder that Emotional Sobriety is above all else a disc...

“Sobriety Didn’t Solve My Problems, It Exposed Them”

24 Jul 2025

Contributed by Lukas

We respond to criticisms leveled at a recent workshop: is Emotional Sobriety somehow alternative, even interruptive, of a faithful rigorous 12 Step pr...

Second First Steps

12 Jul 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Carol Carter returns to the show to talk about letting go of her resentments towards her ex-husband. By freeing him, she freed herself. Many of us fir...

Are These Extravagant Promises? Inconceivable!

03 Jul 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Joe C. joins Patrick and Thom to chat about mutual aid versus self-help: how collectivism can feed our emotional sobriety. When we give ourselves to f...

Right-Sized Expressions

27 Jun 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Joe Chisholm checks back in. We read a passage from his daily reflections book and he brings to our attention “Living Sober,” which was written mo...

Letting Go Never Stops

20 Jun 2025

Contributed by Lukas

This week we talk about taking better lessons from our mistakes. In finding our emotional center of gravity, recognizing we’re sick rather than stuc...

“Lift My Lamp Beside the Golden Door”

14 Jun 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Allen, Thom, and Patrick discuss the recent political upheaval and encroaching fascism of Trump and ICE. Allen relates the tension between our obligat...

Recovery Capital with Samantha Duggan

07 Jun 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Samantha was a psychologist before she found recovery, and her experience with the 12 Steps is just one touchstone in her evolving relationship to lif...

Staying In

30 May 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Having returned from the second annual Recovery Reimagined conference in Dublin, Patrick reflects on the passing of a longtime sober friend who took h...

Bright Sunshine in the Rat Park with Dr. Carl Erik Fisher

17 May 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Allen, Thom, and Patrick welcome addiction psychiatrist Carl Erik Fisher of Columbia University to discuss emotional sobriety. In the pursuit of “ma...

Flowing with Becoming feat. Joe C.

11 May 2025

Contributed by Lukas

When we try to wrestle security from life, we often get pinned. Joe Chisholm offers us this:   Dee Hock (1929-2022) wrote:    “Life is not about ...

Inukshuk with Julia Heidmann

03 May 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Frequent collaborator and fellow recoverer Julia Heidmann stops by to talk about the role emotional sobriety has played in her relationships with othe...

Proficiency vs. Perfection

24 Apr 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Allen, Thom, and Patrick discuss the overwhelm that often occurs as we return to health, and in so doing take on more challenges in our day to day liv...

To Be Human Is to Be Impacted

18 Apr 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Roger Andes returns after a period of recovery to talk with Thom and Patrick about forming a new relationship with our life’s challenges, including ...

Gratitude, Humility, and Awe

11 Apr 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Joe C. brings an existential framework to the discussion, which dredges up Patrick’s recent brushes with mortality and Allen’s titanic wrestling w...

For the Newcomers

05 Apr 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Acceptance of what is sets us on the road to change. While acceptance of powerlessness over alcohol, our dependencies, or lack of emotional sobriety c...

Uncertainty and Emotional Sobriety

27 Mar 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Waiting for the other shoe to drop truly puts our ability to regulate to the test, as it reminds us how little we control, and how much of our strengt...

Filing with the Complaint Department

21 Mar 2025

Contributed by Lukas

In filing our claims with reality’s “complaint department,” we discover new ways of getting in touch with our disturbances, big and small, in or...

Newfound Responsibility

14 Mar 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Joe C. and the crew discuss their emerging conception of living responsibly with emotional sobriety. Ultimately, this depends greatly on our connectio...

Emotions Are (Part Of) the Solution

06 Mar 2025

Contributed by Lukas

A quick one this week. Allen, Thom, and Patrick discuss holding onto ourselves when our relationships are in distress, fear of losing loved ones, and ...

Guidance vs. Advice

28 Feb 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Offering help to those in need without losing ourselves is the order of the day. Before giving advice, “knock on the door” first. Never proceed wi...

Re-Solving

21 Feb 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Joe C. returns to kick things off with a reading from Gabor Maté’s “The Myth of Normal.” Allen and Thom return to our ongoing discussion about ...

The Regret Reduction Program

13 Feb 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Allen and Thom return to familiar emotional sobriety territory of living in the pauses and managing our reactions to fears both real and imagined, whi...

Emotional Sobriety and Love

08 Feb 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Returning to our definition of a more mature love, challenging not the concept of “self” entirely, but an expanding our sense of self to include o...

Seeing More, Seeing Further

31 Jan 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Picking up the discussion from last week, in crafting our emotionally sober foundation and cultivating our awareness, what do we need to be aware of t...

Awareness is the Foundation

24 Jan 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Our awareness is what we use to make contact with the world. The quality of that contact will determine how well we can cope with or adapt to any situ...

Surviving Fire

17 Jan 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Patrick and Allen deal with their own fears and resentments surrounding the Los Angeles wildfires. Patrick welcomes to the pod Los Angeles residents J...

Post-Traumatic Gains

12 Jan 2025

Contributed by Lukas

Why are some people surpassingly resilient in sobriety, not only restoring to their wellness conditions pre-alcoholism and pre-trauma, but emerging ev...

2024 in Review

30 Dec 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Responsibility creates empowerment. Closing this year of the podcast as we look ahead to 2025, Allen, Thom, and Patrick consider the evolution of the ...

Lucky Attachments

24 Dec 2024

Contributed by Lukas

A quick one, before Christmas - Thom and Patrick talk about their sideways shuffle towards emotional sobriety, accepting the things they cannot change...

Any Port in a Storm

08 Dec 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Allen, Joe, and Patrick continue their ongoing discussion of the holiday season, encountering new challenges and opportunities to hold onto themselves...

Early Holiday Observations with Joe C.

25 Nov 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Thom, Patrick and Joe bring to the conversation their individual anticipations and dreads of the Thanksgiving holiday to come. The emotional sobriety ...

Acorn to Oak Tree with Herb K.

17 Nov 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Four of us take stock of our personal arcs towards greater emotional sobriety. Happiness, as Herb Kaighan frames it, isn’t a product of the work we ...

Should Auld Acquaintance Be Forgot

04 Nov 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Going into yet another fraught American Presidential election, Allen, Thom, and Patrick discuss their fears and feelings of debt and responsibility to...

How's Your Practice?

30 Oct 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Friend of the pod Howard Malitz of Seasons of Recovery talks about an extreme test of emotional sobriety on a recent road trip. Thom gives us an updat...

Emotional Sobriety as “Democratic Pluralism”

21 Oct 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Joe C., Allen, and Thom welcome author William Schaberg (Bill), author of 30 Things: Practical Advice for Living Well to discuss recovery and emotiona...

Acknowledging & Accepting Another Perspective

13 Oct 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Joe C., Allen, and Thom read from William Schaberg’s 30 Things: Practical Advice for Living Well to further explore the dismantling of “shoulds.”...

Expanding the Zone of Comfort

06 Oct 2024

Contributed by Lukas

The fellas discuss the role of anger in emotional sobriety. We also read a thoughtful email from one of our Australian listers, about holding onto our...

In Pardoning, We Are Pardoned

29 Sep 2024

Contributed by Lukas

On the journey towards forgiving others, we can’t bypass our grief. Thom, Patrick, and Tom Potash discuss both processing and letting go of grievanc...

He Doth Protest Too Much (Missive from ICSAA)!

22 Sep 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Allen Berger and Joe Chisholm check in from this year’s ICSAA conference in Orlando, Florida, to relay an anecdote from one of the speakers: “we a...

So Worth Living

16 Sep 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Allen, Thom, and Patrick read from the AA Grapevine again and reflect on the story of someone in recovery from addiction who suffered traumatic brain ...

Grip Lightly

09 Sep 2024

Contributed by Lukas

No matter our level of certainty about anything, emotional sobriety advises holding the truth in our hands but gripping it lightly. We find “rolling...

Challenging Core Beliefs

02 Sep 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Our sagely Joe Chisholm returns for heartfelt conversation about the negative self-concepts that can undermine our recoveries. Experiences which are i...

When We Need Outside Help

25 Aug 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Howard Malitz returns to the pod to read and discuss another AA Grapevine article, which deals with the role of therapy, medication, and other mental ...

Accepting the Road Ahead with Dr. Shawn Horn

12 Aug 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Author, psychologist and TEDx speaker Dr. Shawn Horn rejoins us to discuss her upcoming project about adults with ADHD, with particular focus on our n...

Stay Connected & Add More Self

04 Aug 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Joe C. rejoins Allen and Thom this week, to discuss looking beyond what a person is saying to focus on what they’re experiencing. Modeling emotional...

Balancing on the Relational Beam

28 Jul 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Allen, Thom, and Patrick discuss the challenge and opportunity in conducting their relationships in a manner appropriate to those relationships. We ci...

Beating the Questionnaire

14 Jul 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Allen, Thom, and Patrick bring their AA Grapevine series to a close and talk "doomscrolling," rehab, and first steps.   This week’s “Emotional So...

Hurtling Towards Serenity

07 Jul 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Joe C. and Thom join Patrick before Allen pops in to discuss our second to last AA Grapevine reading series on Emotional Sobriety.   This week’s Em...

Life Goes On

23 Jun 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Carol Carter drops by to help us read the latest in Emotional Sobriety from the AA Grapevine - the first article in our series that has some objection...

Get Quiet, and Listen

16 Jun 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Earnie Larsen once said, “Your program cannot take you further than your definition of recovery.” Take a moment and answer the following q...

Connection/Hope/Identity/Meaning/Empowement

03 Jun 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Joe C. brings the CHIME recovery model from a recent workshop into our eternally unfolding discussion of what it means to be emotionally sober. Even w...

Never Judge Your Earlier Self by What You Know Today

27 May 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Thom and Patrick discuss the latest emotional sobriety-centric AA Grapevine article and talk work, God, and acceptance. Next week, Joe C. returns to t...

Spiritual GPS

20 May 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Allen, Thom, and Patrick delve into the latest Emotional Sobriety-centric AA Grapevine article. We discuss rock bottoms, taking action, and the role o...

Any Way You Slice It (Cheerio to London!)

12 May 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Allen and Patrick record face-to-face during some downtime from the three-day Recovery Reimagined event in London to discuss bringing Emotional Sobrie...

Make Plans, Don’t Plan the Results!

29 Apr 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Allen, Thom, and Patrick revisit the principle of staying sober for one more day, even when it would make more sense to get loaded. We also spend some...

So Worth It

21 Apr 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Allen, Thom, and Patrick read another emotional sobriety anecdote from the AA Grapevine and discuss early sobriety, sponsors, and attempting to live b...

Courage to Change

14 Apr 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Thom and Patrick discuss a friend whose wife and baby are in the hospital this weekend in dire straits, as well as Patrick’s recent elective surgery...

Dream Come True

08 Apr 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Allen mines some lessons from a death in the family and Thom reflects on an inspiring recent phase of good health as we land on our latest Grapevine a...

Party Guy

25 Mar 2024

Contributed by Lukas

The Grapevine story Carol, Allen, Thom, and Patrick get into this week has to do with a longtime AA member fielding some annoying criticism from a Fel...

Getting the Help

18 Mar 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Carol Carter joins the pod again (and will be returning next week!) to discuss depth and stages of recovery, culling from a recent Emotional Sobriety-...

Unity = Love

11 Mar 2024

Contributed by Lukas

This week we discuss the “peaceful leveling” that occurs in fellowship, how with greater emotional sobriety our alienating differences can melt aw...

"The Experiment" with Sara Stromberg

04 Mar 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Allen, Thom, and Patrick welcome Sara Stromberg, a many years recovering student of Gestalt therapy who discusses her sobriety and sponsorship of wome...

Passing It On

26 Feb 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Allen, Thom, and Patrick reflect on small simple actions, our claiming of experiences rather than allowing them to claim us, which allow us to better ...

Está Bien

19 Feb 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Howard Malitz returns to the pod to chat with Patrick and Thom about the deeper levels of recovery he discovered in the course of trying to find peace...

"Fear of Economic Insecurity Will Leave Us"

12 Feb 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Joe C. and surprise drop-in guest Howard Malitz discuss the next Grapevine Emotional Sobriety article and go into an intimate discussion of the financ...

Little Surrenders

05 Feb 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Joe C. returns to take a plunge with us into our next Grapevine story about opportunities for emotional sobriety showing up in countless small ways in...

It All Adds Up

29 Jan 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Allen, Thom, Herb K., and Patrick delve further into the AA Grapevine detailing inspirational stories of recovery and emotional sobriety. One particul...

Tending Our Gardens

22 Jan 2024

Contributed by Lukas

For the first of several upcoming episodes with rotating guests unpacking an Emotional Sobriety-themed AA Grapevine issue, Thom and Allen discuss a st...

Our Way of Life with Herb K.

15 Jan 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Longtime collaborator of Allen's Herb K. returns to the pod. In light of a recent enlargement of his spiritual life, Herb discusses Steps 10-12 of the...

To Crush and Not Be Crushed

08 Jan 2024

Contributed by Lukas

Looking ahead to a year ripe with possibilities for bringing the best possible attitude to our trials and tribulations.   Next week we’ll be joined...

Moving Beyond Our Challenging Year

31 Dec 2023

Contributed by Lukas

As we head into another year of the podcast, Carol Carter, Thom, Allen, and Patrick reflect on a painful but also incredibly constructive 2023. Carol’...

Happy Happy, Joy Joy

25 Dec 2023

Contributed by Lukas

Allen and Thom answer some of your Facebook questions and investigate how we can bring the best possible attitude towards a notoriously stressful time...