414: All About Coaching: What Is it? Is it Different from Therapy?

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Feeling Good Podcast | TEAM-CBT - The New Mood Therapy 1h 1m 4 speakers transcribed

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Dr. David Burns 0:07

Hello, and welcome to the Feeling Good Podcast, where you can learn powerful techniques to change the way you feel. I am your host, Dr. Rhonda Borowski, and joining me here in the Murrieta studio is Dr. David Burns. Dr. Burns is a pioneer in the development of cognitive behavioral therapy and the creator of the new Team Therapy. He's the author of Feeling Good, which has sold over 5 million copies in the United States and has been translated into over 30 languages. His latest book, Feeling Great, contains powerful new techniques that make rapid recovery possible for many people struggling with depression and anxiety. Dr. Burns is currently an emeritus adjunct professor of clinical psychiatry at Stanford University School of Medicine. Hi, David. Welcome to our listeners around the world, around the galaxy. This is the Feeling Good podcast and it's episode 414. We have two very special guests today, Angela Poach and Lorna Bird, whom I'll introduce in a second.

Dr. David Burns 1:09

I just want to say that the topic for today is coaching in addition to counseling. And so, hi, Angela.

Angela Poch 1:16

Hi, Lorna. Hi. Hi, Rhonda. Good to see you.

Dr. David Burns 1:20

Yeah, I want to just say a little bit that Angela is a level four team certified specialist, and she also provides tech support for David's website. So she's an incredibly balanced human being. And Lorna Bird is a counselor in Australia. And Lorna is working with Angela in her mentoring group. Maybe you could tell us more about that as we keep going. Sure. Yeah. And you too. Hello, David.

Dr. Rhonda Barofsky 1:53

Hi. Hi, Rhonda. Hello, Rhonda. Hello, Angela. Hello, Rhonda.

Dr. David Burns 2:05

I thought I'd start off today with reading a very beautiful endorsement that came to you via the YouTube channel that now we're posting the podcast with video as well as audio. And someone watched the YouTube video and said, Hey, Dr. David Burns, I'm a reader of Feeling Good and Feeling Great in Korea. You may have heard expressions of gratitude many times, and it might not be as impactful to you. However, I want you to know that you have changed my life and I'm profoundly grateful beyond words. I wish you happiness and good health. Well, thank you so much. I really appreciate your kind and thoughtful statements. And I know that you do too, Rhonda. Absolutely. Because we were reaching out in so many ways in the hopes of touching folks. And when you tell us you have received something positive, it really means a great deal to me and I know to you, Rhonda, also. Definitely.

Dr. David Burns 3:11

We've got two other really neat people today, two of my favorites who are reaching out and talking about a topic that I think is really, really interesting and I hope will be interesting to you folks as well. And it's a little bit on the controversial side, which makes it even more fun to talk about. But What is coaching? This is a new thing that I think is catching on in a pretty significant and big way. You folks can confirm whether or not that's valid, but that's my thought. And we want to find out what is a coach? How does a coach compare with a psychologist? Or how does coaching compare with psychotherapy? Is it a good thing or is it a terrible thing like most psychotherapy? No, I didn't mean to say that.

Dr. David Burns 4:14

But let's hear what these experts have to say. I remember when I was in college, my freshman year, we had a fellow in our class who was blind. David Agnew, I think was his name, a really nice guy and really brilliant guy. And I think he had the idea of becoming a lay psychoanalyst, not doing the route of those days you had to go through medical school first and whatever. you know, a lot of requirements to be a psychoanalyst. And, you know, it was all very important and very controlled. And I remember thinking, gosh, maybe that would be a good idea, have more lay people as psychoanalysts. And so it might be the case here, too, that maybe coaching can bring us something that people with extensive knowledge

Dr. David Burns 5:17

but perhaps somewhat limiting training might not, but we'll find out. We'll dive in and see what's under the surface with regard to coaching.

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Speakers

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Dr. David Burns 33 min Angela Poch 21 min Lorna Bird 5 min Dr. Rhonda Barofsky

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Topics in this episode

David Burns 2 Stanford University School of Medicine 1 Feeling Great 1 Feeling Good 1 Albert Ellis 1 Feeling Great app 1 Tony Robinson 1 Feeling Good Podcast 1 Rhonda Borowski 1 Team CBT 1 International Coaching Federation 1 Team CBT International 1

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Recorded16 Sep 2024

Publisherpod.link ↗

CollectionAudioscrape Public Library

Transcriptspeaker-named · 100+ languages

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Feeling Down? Try the Feeling Great App for Free! The Feeling Great App is now available in both app stores (IOS and Android) and is for therapists and the general public, and you can take a ride for free! Check it out at FeelingGreat.com! Life Coaching: A New Dimension in Counseling Today we discuss the recent upsurge in life coaching, and feature one of the leaders in this emerging field, Angela Poch, and one of her wonderful students, Lorna Bird. Lorna Bird Angela Poch (see featured photo) is a Registered Professional Counsellor (RPC) with the Canadian Professional Counselling Association, certified Master Life Coach, and TEAM-CBT Level 4 Advanced Therapist and Trainer. She has been teaching health and wellness for over 30 years and was Vice President of Education with the Adventist Association of Health & Wellness Coaching. She has written several articles and books on health and wellness including, “The Truth Will Set You Free.” She has a YouTube channel (@talkingteamcbt) interviewing clinicians about their journeys with TEAM-CBT. She also has a channel on psychology and health (@bodymindhealth4u). Lorna Bird holds a Diploma of Counseling from Australia and is a certified Life and Health Coach. She is also a Level 3 certified TEAM-CBT therapist https://www.yestohealth.com.au/ Angela and Lorna will give us the true scoop on coaching. To get started, what IS coaching, and how does it differ from psychotherapy? I am aware that our podcast goes worldwide, so the answer may differ depending on the country or state where you live. According to AI, “In California, the term "psychotherapist" is defined in the Civil Code to include a number of mental health professionals, including psychologists, psychiatrists, and clinical social workers. In general, anyone who provides psychotherapy or counseling in California, whether in person, by phone, or online, must be licensed.in California.” Coaching is quite different. Again, according to AI, “In California, there are no specific state-mandated requirements for individuals to use the term "coach" or practice life coaching, meaning anyone can technically call themselves a coach without obtaining a specific license.” Angela Poch resides in Canada, and she has been a leading and beloved member of the TEAM-CBT community. She emphasized several differences between a “coach” and a licensed mental health professional: Diagnosis: A coach does not diagnose clients into the familiar DSM categories of “mental disorders,” such as “Major Depressive Illness,” “Bipolar Disorder,” “Schizophrenia,” or any of the hundreds of “mental disorders” listed in the DSM. In the same vein, licensed mental health professionals will typically screen for suicidal thoughts and urges, and will treat suicidal individuals, but this is forbidden territory for coaches. Purpose / aims of coaching: The purpose or aims of coaching do not, as a rule, involve delving into your past to search for the “cause(s)” of your problems, such as adverse childhood experiences or traumas. Instead, the focus of coaching is primarily on making changes in the here-and-now in how you think, feel, and relate to others. This might involve learning to challenge distorted negative thoughts so you will think and feel more positively about your life, as well as how to relate to others more skillfully. Coaching is goal-oriented and forward-moving rather than dwelling on the past. Of course, good counsellors and licensed mental health professionals may also provide tools to move forward as well, so there can be overlap. Training / credentialing: Because coaching is so new, there are not yet any widely accepted standards or requirements for calling yourself a “coach.” There is a varying degree of training to be “certified,” which might just consist of watching a couple videos to 100’s of hours of supervision with the ICF (International Coaching Federation), and everything in between. Here’s a generalized diagram Angela created to help with further clarification. NOTE: many TEAM-CBT therapists also are client/goal focused as well as and will often use coaching-style tools. Angela described a 20-hour “Feeling Great Coach” certification program she has developed. Her program is based almost entirely on TEAM-CBT and includes a final exam you must pass to get certified. She also offers a TEAM-CBT Masterclass & Mentoring Program for both coaches as well as therapists that includes live training twice a month, online practice groups, case consultation in small groups, one-on-one mentoring sessions, and personal work as well. She said this integrates seamlessly with FGI’s Fast Track program, any of David’s intensives, or the Tuesday group for those who want more individualized support and training. Lorna enthusiastically described her experiences learning from many of Angela’s training programs. I (David) have had the pleasure of knowing and working with Angela for many years now, starting with her attendance at a number of my intensives and two-day TEAM-CBT training programs in Canada. Lorna is really enjoying the Masterclass Mentoring Program and recommends you take Angela’s free workshop called “Effective Compassion.” You can check it out at www.teamcbt.ca/effectivecompassion How do I, David, feel about coaching? I am, for the most part, enthusiastic, but with a few reservations. I would have to confess that I spent 5 years in medical school, four more years in psychiatric residency, plus two years in post-doctoral research training at top institutions, but did not learn much at all, if anything, that has really helped me treat human beings who are hurting. Of course, I did learn how to prescribe drugs for those with severe difficulties, like Bipolar I Disorder, or Paranoid Schizophrenia, but that definitely did not require years and years of intensive medically oriented training. All I ever really wanted to do was psychotherapy. In my last year or so of post-doctoral psychiatric training, I discovered cognitive therapy, although it was not a part of the required curriculum, and learned quite a lot that has been really helpful in working with patients. But for the most part, all of the extensive medical training I received had very little, at best, to do with how I now work with patients, and an awful lot of what I do was things I had to figure out for myself. I do have great respect for psychology training (either clinical psychology or PsyD training), because of the emphasis on research and critical thinking, but I do think there is lots of room for new approaches such as coaching to emerge and evolve, and it seems to be the case that more people than ever are still struggling with depression, anxiety, addictions, rage, and more. Like any field, I think coaching is vulnerable to misuse by narcissistic individuals who wish to deceive or exploit the general public, and individuals who are naïve or unaware of the background or training of their therapists are perhaps at great risk of abuse. But I would also say that this problem is in no way limited to coaching, since a great many licensed mental health professionals have been charged and convicted of all manner of unethical conduct and as well as malpractice over the years as well. That’s why I’m enthusiastic about responsible leaders who, like Angela Poch, are blazing new trails and setting the bar high for those who wish to enter the field of life coaching. I’m also delighted to see that for years now, the Feeling Good Institute (FGI, feelinggoodinsititute.com) has included coaches in their superb training programs as well, and many high profile individuals you may be familiar with, like our beloved Professor Mark Noble, have taken and benefit from TEAM-CBT certification via the FGI. To learn more, contact Angela at [email protected] or visit https://angelapoch.com/ to learn about Angela’s many training and treatment programs. You can reach Lorna at:[email protected] or https://www.yestohealth.com.au/ And here is the contact information for TEAM-CBT Australia: https://www.teamcbtaustralia.com.au/

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