Chapter 1: What led to the capture of Nicolas Maduro by the US?
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Hello, I'm Oliver Conway. We're recording this at 12.30 GMT on Saturday the 3rd of January. The US says it's captured the Venezuelan president Nicolas Maduro after launching airstrikes on Caracas and other cities. Venezuela has declared a state of emergency and condemned the attack as a colonial war. We don't know where president Nicolas Maduro is.
In the face of this brutal situation and in the face of this brutal attack, we have no knowledge of the whereabouts of the president, Nicolas Maduro. We'll hear from Caracas and Washington and get reaction from our chief international correspondent, Lise Doucette. He never has used the phrase regime change with Venezuela, casting it along with his top officials as being a national security threat. It is clear that this is regime change in all but name.
From the banana wars of the early 20th century to Cold War proxy battles, the US has a long history of military intervention in Latin America. But not since the invasion of Panama nearly four decades ago has America unleashed the might of its armed forces in the region it considers its backyard. That has all changed under President Trump, despite his vow not to get involved in foreign wars. For months he's been agitating for the overthrow of Venezuelan President Nicolas Maduro.
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Chapter 2: How has Venezuela reacted to the US military intervention?
Since September, US forces have killed about 100 people on alleged drug boats in the region. And at 2 o'clock this morning local time, the American military launched a major attack on the Venezuelan capital, Caracas.
Footage posted on social media showed huge explosions across the city, while dozens of helicopters thought to be Chinooks and Apaches flew overhead. Then at around four in the morning in Florida, President Trump posted on Truth Social saying US forces had successfully carried out a large-scale strike on Venezuela, and that the Venezuelan president, Nicolas Maduro, and his wife had been captured and flown out of the country.
Venezuela condemned the attack as a colonial war. The defense minister said Venezuela's armed forces and people would fight to defend themselves. The vice president, Delcy Rodriguez, had this message for the United States.
In the face of this brutal situation and in the face of this brutal attack, we have no knowledge of the whereabouts of the President Nicolas Maduro and the First Lady Celia Flores. We demand from the Donald Trump government immediate proof of life for President Maduro and the First Lady. We demand our international rights be respected.
Anna-Vanessa Herrero on kirjailija Karakassa ja hän on saanut meille tämän raportin.
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Chapter 3: What historical context is important for understanding US actions in Venezuela?
I started hearing the planes around 2 a.m. local time. And I heard a huge sound, a loud bang that moved all the windows, not only in my place, but around the area. And immediately after I saw a huge cloud of smoke that almost blocked the entire view. And a lot of detonations. And immediately after a lot of people died.
started reporting from different parts of Caracas, of the capital of Caracas. The same things that I was witnessing, the same reports, the same explosions, the same sounds of planes and helicopters flying all over the city. Now we do know that the government confirmed that this attack was not only in Caracas, but in Miranda and Aragua too.
And also in La Guaira. So Aragua and La Guaira are very important locations in Venezuela. Military, they're very important for the military, of course. But in La Guaira, it's where the port and the airport are. And apparently...
There are reports of the port of Venezuela being absolutely destroyed. There are several videos shared on social media that show a very popular street in La Guaira, in the port of Venezuela. You can see the devastation of the building of the port of La Guaira.
Anna-Vanessa Herrero, Venezuelan capital, Caracas. So what should we make of these extraordinary developments, I asked our Americas correspondent Will Grant, who is currently in Washington.
It is really, genuinely nothing less than historic. It is an extraordinary moment in US-Latin American relations, obviously in US-Venezuelan relations, but it has implications that go beyond the borders of Venezuela. First and foremost and most immediately, the Colombian president has said that he is sending troops to the Colombian-Venezuelan border.
Let's not forget that there are left-wing armed groups, armed rebels that still operate in Venezuelan soil and move back and forth through that porous border. And he fears that they would become drawn into whichever conflict, further conflict that may take place in Venezuela. There are also implications for Cuba, which is thoroughly dependent on Venezuelan crude oil for its revolution to be successful.
Joten se on hyvin erityinen tilanne nykyisessä Latino-Amerikassa. Ja tietenkin emme tiedä, missä seuraava konfliktin jälkeen mennään. Tiedämme tietenkin, että Maduro ja hänen isänsä, Presidentin Trumpin, sanoivat, että he eivät ole enää Venäjällä. Ja heidät on saanut Yhdysvalloille, joilla uskomme, että he pitävät haasteita.
Mutta me olemme kuulleet vain Venäjän puolesta, että huoneet ylittävät lisää puolesta, puolesta puolesta puolesta puolesta puolesta puolesta puolesta puolesta.
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Chapter 4: What implications does Maduro's capture have for US-Latin American relations?
Well, we can only speculate at this stage. There is a press conference in Mar-a-Lago, President Trump's Florida residence, due in a few hours, and hopefully we'll hear more information there. But we speculate that there must have been, or we believe there may have been, some kind of inside information making its way directly to Washington state.
insecure channels, that may mean that somebody quite close in Mr. Maduro's inner circle has turned on him. That is the plausible explanation for how this could have unfolded quite so cleanly and quickly. Marco Rubio apparently spoke to a senator in the United States and made those sorts of explanations. It was Republican Senator Mike Lee who said that
Marco Rubio, the Secretary of State, had told him that Nicolas Maduro has been arrested by US personnel to stand trial on criminal charges in the United States. And that, as he put it, the kinetic action we saw tonight was deployed to protect and defend those executing the arrest warrant. And further down he added in a comment to that post on social media, he anticipates no further action in Venezuela now that Maduro is in US custody.
We are yet to get, as it were, more detail, the full story of these points being raised on social media by senators and by other members of the administration. But we do know the US has been massing military forces off Venezuela for months and threatening military action. What more do we know about the sites that were targeted overnight?
No, niitä on kaksi. Ne ovat militäriset installaatiot Karakassan sisällä. Ensimmäinen on nimeltään La Carlota. Se on militärinen airstrippi, joka on oikeastaan hyvin keskustelussa Karakassa. Sitä menetetään, kun otat yhden tärkeimmän tarifeen kautta kaupungin ympärille. Ja se on vain siellä.
The other is called Fuerte Tiuna. That's the most important military base. One of the most important military bases in the country. Certainly the most important in Caracas. Very large, important military base. We don't know what the damage, the full extent of the damage has been to those two sites. We do know that power went out to both of them and to surrounding communities when those strikes took place. You're in Washington. What will Americans make of this after President Trump promised not to get involved in foreign wars?
Luulen, että se on yleinen kuvauksena. Tietysti Venäjä-amerikkalainen ja kuban-amerikkalainen yhteisö, jotka ovat konservatiivisia, konservatiivinen osa niistä yhteisöistä, voivat kiittää ideaa, että Nicolas Maduro on poistettu ja hänen isänsä on saanut Yhdysvalloille haittaa. Joten jos yhdysvallojen kohdalla Yhdysvalloissa on jotain, jota voidaan tehdä, niin vain noin 30 prosenttia votoja tuntuu, että Yhdysvalloissa on Yhdysvallan militiaalinen tehtävä.
President Trump has a lot of his constituency still to win over by the idea of this. Now, that polling was taken before there had been any military action and before it could be deemed as it were successful or painted as being successful by the Trump administration.
One will be interested to see exactly what the reaction is now that Nicolas Maduro has been removed. And if the Trump administration can show that was done with no harm to civilian population or to US service personnel, then he will be able to more easily portray it as a victory.
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Chapter 5: Who are the key players in Venezuela following Maduro's capture?
The idea of one leader being removed and another stepping in is a deceptively simple question. He has, Mr Maduro, a very loyal circle around him. Four key players, one of which is the vice president, Delcio Rodriguez. Another is the minister of internal affairs. He's kind of the second in command. Viostadokaveo.
He will be wanting to maximize and really take advantage of this situation, which is incredibly uncertain. I think the idea that we'll know who will be the next leader of Venezuela is not going to be one which will be immediately answered. This is probably a question and an answer for days ahead. Right now we're seeing police on the streets kind of cascading anybody who's showing any idea of celebrations. We know that there are armed militias, civilians who've been armed under the order of Nicolas Maduro, who are going to be looking for anybody celebrating.
and going against the state of commotion, meaning people have to stay indoors. But the idea that the opposition are going to swoop in and assume power of Venezuela is one which is false. This will be a long, long journey.
And that was our global affairs reporter Mimi Swaybi. Colombia has expressed profound concern about the US raid and sent troops to the Colombia-Venezuela border, while Venezuela's allies Russia and Cuba have condemned the attack. But Argentina's president welcomed the US intervention, posting on social media, liberty advances. So how might others react? Dr. Christopher Sabatini is an expert on Latin America at the international think tank Chatham House.
It's going to be interesting. So let's try to break this out a bit. I think for European allies, many of whom had opposed Nicolás Maduro, had denounced the elections, this is still coming as somewhat of a surprise. Some of it is a step too far. I think many of them will welcome the fact that there could potentially be a democratic transition. We'll reemphasize the fact that Maduro was an illegitimate president in Venezuela. But of course what comes next is really going to be the key, because as
Kaikki ovat sanoneet, kuten Trumpin hallituksessa, että tämä on todella rikollinen, korrupti regiimi. Jos regiiminen muuttuu sisällä, ja jotkut ajattelevat nyt, että presidentti Delcy Rodrigues on jostain tapaa valmistamassa jonkinlainen alkuperäinen rooli, se ei ole paljastettava monille hallituksille, vaikka Euroopan unionin sisällä.
So we'll have to see how this shakes out. I think we'll see, again, denunciation of Nicolas Maduro, but some trepidation, concern even about U.S. tactics to get there. But in particular, what will happen in the next few days is going to determine how many governments will respond. If it's by some miracle a successful operation that leads to a democratic transition and peace in Venezuela, then perhaps the norm-violating actions of the Trump administration will be forgotten. But if it
If it suddenly turns south, I think we're going to see much more criticism. For other governments within Latin America, we are going to see from the left-leaning governments, such as in Mexico, Brazil and Colombia, severe denunciations of this intervention. From the other governments that are closely aligned with the Donald Trump administration, I think they'll remain quiet.
Ja todellisuus on se, että Maduro jatkuu olevansa syvästi epäsuomalaisilta Suomessa, siksi, että hänellä on transnationaalisia rikollisia liikkeitä ja siksi, että Venäjällä on jatkuvaa enemmän kuin 8 miljoonaa rikkoja. Ja he ovat laajentaneet vaikeuksia, eikä edellisestä turvallisuudesta, vaan edellisestä turvallisuudesta, kuten opetuksen, terveydenhuoltoa ja niin edelleen.
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Chapter 6: What challenges lie ahead for Venezuela after Maduro's removal?
among many of Venezuela's neighbors, so they will welcome this change. But the governments themselves, especially of the left, will feel a duty to denounce this as a violation of national sovereignty. Christopher Sabatini of Chatham House. When Donald Trump returned to the White House a year ago, he promised to be a president of peace, vowing not to start any new wars. So what should we make of his attack on Venezuela, the biggest US intervention in Latin America for decades? A question I put to our chief international correspondent, Lise Doucette.
It certainly does harken back to those decades which were described as gunboat diplomacy, where the US felt it had every right to meddle, often through the CIA in toppling regimes, fomenting dissent. And when President Trump entered the White House for a second term, as you've been mentioning, he was very clear that that era was over, that he would no longer, as he said in a major policy speech in Riyadh,
be intervening in countries where the united states had little understanding it would not be taking part in nation building he would be letting countries determine their own future a speech that received tremendous applause on his first foreign trip across the gulf region many capitals beyond also welcomed this new approach by president trump who had promised in his inauguration speech to be a unifier
Ja rauhoittaja, no, mitä on tapahtunut tänä päivänä, on todennäköisesti ylöspäin. Ja se tarkoittaa, mitä, kuten aina presidentin Trumpin kanssa, ei ole kauhean selvää, missä hän on. Koska yhden viikon jälkeen ja joskus yhden päivän jälkeen hän näyttää, että hän on vahvasti...
different approaches on key issues of our time. And even though he never has used the phrase regime change with Venezuela, casting it as well as along with his top officials as being a national security threat, that President Maduro was an illegitimate president, it is clear that this is regime change in all but name.
According to comments attributed to the US Secretary of State Marco Rubio, President Maduro will be put on trial on criminal charges. I mean, that will be quite a sight.
All of the world's cameras will be on that if they are planning to make a show of this, to make an example of President Maduro on drug trafficking charges. We heard from a U.S. senator. He has confirmed that he is going to stand trial on criminal charges. He said he received that information from the Secretary of State Marco Rubio. It is of course not the first time that the United States puts
Latin American leaders accused of drug trafficking on trial, and it's not escaped notice that a key Honduran official, who had been in jail on drug trafficking, was recently pardoned by President Trump. He wasn't a president, but he certainly was a key figure in the economy of Honduras. So contradictory moves by President Trump, who says it's all about drugs.
fighting the scourge of drugs and narcotics which are entering the United States. But I think this morning has really pulled back the curtain on this and that it is about something much deeper and indeed in the eyes of many more dangerous.
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