The Global Story: The post-World War II era is over. What comes next?
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What does the end of the post-World War II era mean for global politics?
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Hey there, I'm Asma Khalid. And I'm Tristan Redman.
And we're here with a bonus episode for you from the Global Story podcast. Every day we focus on one story, looking at how America and the world shape each other.
So we hope you enjoy this episode. And to find more of our show, just search for The Global Story, wherever you get your BBC podcasts.
The world order as we've known it is being upended.
Great powers and strong men are trying to use their muscle and might to expand territory. And there's no better man to help us make sense of these tectonic shifts than the BBC's international editor, Jeremy Bowen.
How do current global powers challenge the rules-based international order?
The world has changed so much that it's going to be very difficult for a couple of strong leaders to impose their will on everybody. The danger is that little crises can become big crises and suddenly things start slipping out of control. One of the things that would stop, you'd hope, things slipping out of control is some kind of rules-based system.
From the BBC, I'm Tristan Redmond in London.
And I'm Asma Khalid in Washington, DC.
And today on The Global Story, the post-World War II era is over. What comes next?
Could you introduce yourself, please? I'm Jeremy Bowen. I'm the international editor of BBC News.
What historical context is necessary to understand the rules-based international order?
Thank you for joining us. Good to be back.
So all this week, we've been talking about spheres of influence around the world. We've looked at the American, the Chinese, the Russian spheres of influence, and we've looked at how they've been vying for influence in Africa. Today, we're going to try and patch it all together. as well as looking at parts of the world that we haven't talked about yet. So I wanted to just go back in time a little bit and set up where the idea of a rules-based international order came from. So last weekend, Jeremy, I found myself listening to a speech by Winston Churchill.
Ladies and gentlemen, you're assembled.
This is not normally the sort of thing I do on a Saturday, but my daughter...
What were the successes of the rules-based order after World War II?
picked up a book about Churchill and read it. She's 11. And when she finished reading it, she saw this vinyl record that I had, which was a vinyl record of Churchill speeches that I was given by my mother-in-law. And we ended up listening to this speech he gave in 1943 to Harvard University about the way he saw the world after the Second World War.
The people of the United States cannot escape world responsibility. We have now reached a point in the journey where there can be no pause. We must go on. It must be world anarchy or world order.
Basically, he said, the United States has a responsibility to operate in the world. It cannot withdraw from the world.
What examples illustrate the failures of the international rules-based order?
We have learned from hard experience that stronger, more efficient, more rigorous world institutions must be created. to preserve peace and to forestall the causes of future wars.
If there was going to be peace after the Second World War, there needed to be something that he called a World Council. So I guess something resembling the UN Security Council. And then after the war, the Truman Doctrine happened. And it just so happens that this week is the 80th anniversary of the beginning of the UN Security Council. So, Jeremy, what do you make of that ambition to create this kind of international rules based world order? Was it an admirable thing or was it misguided?
It was, of course, admirable after the horrors of the Second World War and indeed the horrors of the first half of the 20th century to try to find a better way. There had been a failure after the First World War.
How has the perception of international law changed in recent conflicts?
There was an international organization called the League of Nations that never really worked. So after the World War II, so much had changed. The United States had become a world power, a world military power, an industrial power. the old European powers were broken, Britain included. And when Churchill was speaking in that speech you referenced, his whole strategy in the Second World War, apart from just fighting on, was trying to get the Americans as engaged as possible.
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Chapters
8 chapters
1
What does the end of the post-World War II era mean for global politics?
0:00–1:27
2
How do current global powers challenge the rules-based international order?
1:27–2:25
3
What historical context is necessary to understand the rules-based international order?
2:25–3:14
4
What were the successes of the rules-based order after World War II?
3:14–3:57
5
What examples illustrate the failures of the international rules-based order?
3:57–4:56
6
How has the perception of international law changed in recent conflicts?
4:56–6:07
7
What alternatives to the current global order are being proposed?
6:07–7:21
8
What future challenges may arise in global governance?
7:21–31:08