Chapter 1: What are the main challenges facing England's leadership team ahead of the white-ball series?
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Hello, I'm Kevin Howells. Welcome to the Test Match Special podcast, where England's men are preparing for their white ball series in Sri Lanka before the T20 World Cup, which is now just over two weeks away. But as we've sort of got used to in recent weeks with England at the moment, it's batters off the field which are taking the headlines.
I'm alongside the BBC's chief cricket commentator, Jonathan Agnew, and the chief cricket reporter, Stefan Schemmelt. Hello to you both. First to Steph, you're out there in Sri Lanka right now. There's just no stopping this, is there? From one country to another. How are you coping?
Chapter 2: How has Harry Brook's off-field conduct impacted his role on the team?
I'm fine. I suppose it gives a little bit of an insight, doesn't it, into what the players are up to as well in terms of their winter. England started in New Zealand, then on to Australia and now straight into this tour of Sri Lanka that precedes the World Cup. And of course, they're young men, they're international cricketers. What's not to like about playing cricket for England?
But there are lots of other things that go with that. And I guess that's what we're going to get into today with what happened with Harry Brook in New Zealand and a lot of the off-field stuff that went on in Australia and what might change as a result. And as a knock-on to that, the changes that are enforced, things like...
curfews and cultures and some on field things like a fielding coach being brought into the England set up, what that might mean as a knock on to the hierarchy, particularly Brendan McCullum, how results might be impacted and whether or not Brendan McCullum feels like that is an environment he can work in going future. So there's lots of different things to unpack.
Chapter 3: What does the England white-ball captain say about earning his teammates' trust?
about this England team, about the setup, in what's been a very short space of time. We're less than, what, two weeks since that final Ashes test ended in Sydney.
Jonathan, how are you enjoying what can only be described, I imagine, as the more refreshing morning or afternoon walks here in the UK? How are you settling back in?
Yes, it was 43 in Sydney the day I was supposed to go. I did have two canceled flights. So, actually, we didn't get back for about four days, I think, after we were supposed to. But, hey, you know, these things happen. But, you know, Stefan's right about The whole travel aspect, it is easy just to think, well, there are international sports and then just get on with it.
But they are young men with young families often. They won't have spent much time at home. I'm not offering that as an excuse at all. for what went on in Australia and in New Zealand. But it's interesting to put it into context, isn't it? The amount of time that England's cricketers, if they're playing every format, do play these days and how much time they spend away.
So just briefly before we hear from Harry Brook, with all the experience as a player you have, as well as a correspondent over however many years it is, this is not new really. These sort of issues we're talking about here, we've had very high profile cases in years gone by of England on tour. Can you put this Harry Brook episode into context with other events, say, in the past?
Right, so we're talking off-field stuff here. We're not talking about the preparation and so on. We're talking about off-field. I mean, OK, I can take you back to the sex, drugs and rock and roll tour of New Zealand, which was 1983 or thereabouts. A lot of the allegations unproven, I hasten to add. But that's what that tour was dubbed.
And there was a fairly high profile, very well-recognised figures on that tour. Ian Botham was on that trip. So, you know, personally, I can take it back to that. There's the Pedalo or the Fredalo, if you want to call it that. And that was, of course, in the West Indies before the World Cup there with Andrew Flintoff, famously the evening before a game.
He was dropped, of course, for the match the following day. I think, I mean, I don't know anything really since then. And I think that's, you know, the 2013 Tour of Australia kind of fell apart. But that wasn't through this sort of thing. That was more individuals not getting on with each other and falling out. And then the end of an era for a team and everyone kind of knew it was unravelling.
OK, well, let's hear from the England white ball captain then. He's done quite an intriguing interview here as Harry Brooke, obviously facing the media for the first time since details emerged of his incident with a bouncer in New Zealand, which was the tour before the Ashes, of course. Here he is right now. He's been speaking to Stefan.
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Chapter 4: What changes are being considered for the England cricket team's culture?
You said you put yourself into a situation that you shouldn't have done. Why were you out drinking on that evening and is that something that normally happens the night before a game?
No, it definitely doesn't. We just went out for some food and we just said, let's go for a drink. There was no intention of going out, no intention of putting ourselves in a tricky situation. It just managed to happen. Obviously, if I had my time again, I definitely wouldn't do it again.
There was an incident outside a nightclub. You felt that you needed to tell the management about what happened.
Yeah, definitely. If I hadn't have told them and I didn't get them punishments, then the punishments would be even worse and more severe. So I'm glad that I told them. I trusted the ECB in telling them that I made a mistake. Thankfully I'm still playing cricket for England and that's a childhood dream.
Like I said, the punishments could have been a lot more severe so I'm glad that I told them and we dealt with it. Did you tell them straight away before the game? No, I told them mid-game. I felt like I needed to reflect on it and try and come up with a plan to negate what had happened really.
Was it resolved before you went to Australia?
Yeah, we'd sorted the disciplinaries and the fines before that. Did you think you'd be sacked? It was definitely playing through my mind, definitely. Like I said, thankfully I'm just playing cricket for England now and I can concentrate on what we've got going forward. As a captain, I know that I've made a mistake and that's not setting the example.
So me as a player and a leader now, I've got to try and take this team forward and see what we can do over the next coming weeks and months. Did you consider resigning? No, it never came into my mind. I left that decision to the hierarchy. Look, if they'd have sacked me from being captain, then I'd have been perfectly fine with it as long as I was still playing cricket for England.
Do you feel like you're lucky to still be in the job? Probably slightly, yeah. Like I say, even if I had have been sacked, I'd have held my hands up and said, look, I made the mistake and I'd have been perfectly fine with getting sacked from the job as captain as long as I was still playing cricket.
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Chapter 5: How does Harry Brook reflect on his recent mistakes and their consequences?
No, definitely not. I thought it had all gone by, to be honest. I didn't think it would ever come out. And obviously we got struck with it after the last Test match. I don't think it affected my performances at all.
Knowing what had happened in Wellington, why were you so open with things like drinking in Noosa? Why were you happy to be photographed in bars and things like that?
We weren't exactly happy to be photographed. We were looking over our shoulder every second to see if there was a camera there.
It was quite public there, wasn't it, to be drinking on this side of the road?
Yeah, definitely. And look, we're in such a high pressure situation and series with the Aussies being as good as what they are, the country with press paparazzi following us around everywhere. And it's just nice to be normal humans, go out and have a drink and try and relax. And yeah, that's one way to take your mind off the game is just having a drink with a few mates.
We were drinking responsibly bar one situation. Other than that, we were... We were completely in control of what we were doing and we were just going out and having a drink. It was nothing silly.
What do you think about suggestions of a drinking culture in the team? Is that fair?
I don't think there's a drinking culture at all. We're all old enough and grown up enough to be able to say no if we don't want to drink and grown up enough to be able to say yes if you do want to drink.
But is there a curfew in place now?
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Chapter 6: What does Harry Brook reveal about the incident in New Zealand?
You'll know that there's pressure on the management, the very top, and maybe Brendan in particular. How much do you guys feel that over the next couple of months you owe something to him to produce some results both here in Sri Lanka and at the World Cup?
Yeah, every tour that we go on, we want to try and win. This isn't a special one, obviously it's the T20 World Cup, but every tour we want to go on, every game we want to go on, we want to win. So, yeah, we've got a big series coming up here against a strong side in their own conditions, and then it's good preparation before the T20 World Cup.
You need some wins as well for that one-day ranking to make sure that you qualify for the World Cup automatically.
Yeah, definitely. We won't be taking these games lightly at all. We want to go out there and win and play our best cricket.
And just finally from me, how are the guys that were in Australia? You said yourself that you didn't want to be at home in the cold. You'd rather be here and playing cricket. But everyone's different. Some people need rest, some people don't. How are the people that have already been on tour quite a long time so far this winter?
Yeah, good, I think. You can't take your England cricket career lightly. Obviously, I've made a couple of mistakes in the last couple of months, but you want to play every game that you possibly can do for England and everybody's really looking forward to this series. Like you said, it's a big series.
We need to win a few games of one-day cricket and then the T20 is a perfect preparation going into the T20 World Cup, especially in these conditions where the T20 World Cup is going to be played as well. Everybody's looking forward to it and everybody's on a bit of a high at the minute.
And just finally, a fielding coach, specialist fielding coach joining you guys for the later part of this tour and for the World Cup. How much, I don't know, is admission that maybe you didn't get that quite right previously during the Ashes and that that discipline is something that you really need to work on going forward?
Yeah, look, I think there was a stat out there in the Ashes that we dropped 17 catches for 500 runs or something like that.
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Chapter 7: What measures are being implemented to improve discipline within the team?
If you're the boss, you can't have that landscape out in front of you. You have to change. You have to make things different because it's unprofessional. What happened was unprofessional. And so somebody has to be accountable for that. I've felt, actually, there's Rob Key that's accountable for that, because he's McCullum's boss, if you like.
They're big mates, and that has to be something that's going to make it awkward. That is not an easy relationship for Rob Key suddenly to tell Brendan McCullum what to do. Now, because they're big mates, if McCullum wants to keep the job, then he might well obviously take on the things that are being put his way. But you can't change a person. Brendan McCullum, is Brendan McCullum.
That's the way that he played cricket. It's the human being that he is. He's an extremely sociable, very friendly, very affable, very easygoing fella. That's what he is. And at the time, and I think it's really important to stress this, at the time that he and Stokes came in, they were a breath of fresh air.
And the whole start of the Baz Ball, if you want to call it that, era, was because of Brendan McCullum. He brought that breath of fresh air. He instilled that environment in that dressing room that enabled those largely the same players to rediscover themselves and to play good cricket again. And he deserves a huge amount of credit for that.
Where they got it wrong is they didn't see actually that there was a point at which they had to stop that, or at least keep where they were, but then recognise that they're not going to
consistently win against good opposition by continuing to play in such a lackadaisical, ill-disciplined way and also that off the field they had to tighten up and that's where they've gone wrong and if they can get back to where they were if you like the first part of it but with the discipline instilled in it, then I think there's still a way that they can go forward.
But they have to accept, they have to accept that the nonsense that we had for the last two and a half years of that time was nonsense. And people were telling them it was nonsense. And they were told that they were... not irrelevant, that the game's changed. You don't understand. Sorry, it's all different. Well, it's not.
Stefan, Jonathan has talked about Rob Key in all this. Is it possible that only one of him or McCullum survives this, given how close they are, perhaps as friends as well as working colleagues?
Yeah, I think that there is definitely a world where that happens. I would say at the moment, by the time England play their first international of the summer, and that is a test match, the most likely scenario is that Rob Key is still the director of cricket and Ben Stokes is the captain. And it is the future of Brendan McCullum that is now...
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Chapter 8: How does the team plan to prepare for the upcoming T20 World Cup?
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