Trump 2.0: Bans, Purges and Retribution
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From The New York Times, I'm Michael Barbaro. This is The Daily. Over the past 48 hours, President Trump banned DEI programming in the federal government, punished three former aides by taking away their security detail, and celebrated the release of hundreds of January 6th rioters and planners — Today, I talked through all of that with three of my Times colleagues, White House reporters Maggie Haberman, Zolan Kano-Youngs, and David Sanger. It's Friday, January 24th. Friends, welcome back to The Roundtable. Maggie, Zolan, David, thank you for being here.
Thanks, Michael. Thanks.
Thank you. Last time the three of you were on the show, your locations were incredibly exotic. Mar-a-Lago, Italy... Where were you, Maggie? Washington, D.C. Washington, D.C. Today we join you from two boring studios on the East Coast. We are taping this on Thursday afternoon at the end of week one of the Trump presidency, and what a week it has been. I don't think it's a stretch to say that in record time President Trump has begun to remake both the federal government and arguably American society in his image in just a few days. And I want to start with late-breaking policy that we haven't covered on the show from the White House, and that is around DEI, diversity, equity, and inclusion. What exactly, Zolan, had the policy been, and what has Trump just changed it to?
So basically throughout the federal government, all the different cabinet agencies, you had these different programs that were focused on increasing diversity. In the previous administration's mind, it was programs that would basically be addressing decades of systemic inequalities and racism. And it's worth also saying this DEI has ramped up recently, but it's not necessarily new, came out of legislation in the 60s, what have you. Trump comes into office and one of his executive orders essentially calls this immoral and saying that under the guise of diversity, that actually this is promoting inequality, right? Just in recent days, his administration has taken a number of actions, right? So that includes a directive to put those that are working and leading DEI initiatives on paid leave. It also includes sending out memos to each agency, basically asking different federal employees to report any indication or any work that may be in progress that is in line with DEI initiatives.
I've talked to federal employees who have said that this makes them feel as if they have to almost turn in their own peers. Hmm. who might be working on this broad term as well. And that sent a chilling effect in the private sector as well, where now you have companies that are basically trying to decide, do we still maintain these programs that were meant to promote diversity? Do we shy away from it? Do we rename it? Is it just that the acronym is toxic in itself? You've seen multiple actions at this point. to follow through on what during the campaign was fiery rhetoric, but now seems to be an attempt to be at least one piece of reshaping this administration in a way that's aligned with the president.
I want to make sure I understand how widespread DEI programs and personnel have been in the government to understand the impact of these executive orders. The executive orders and actions that attempt to root it out, essentially to forbid it, and the ones that attempt to encourage employees to report on issues essentially what's now banned attempt at enforcing DEI. Who among you has a sense of just how much government we're talking about here?
My sense is that it is actually not that gigantic a portion of the federal government, but it does exist in various pockets of agencies. It shouldn't be surprising. Trump did say all of this, as Nolan said, during the campaign. He is doing what he said he was going to do. But what is striking is this climate of fear that has been created within the federal government to say not just are we getting rid of these programs, but we are looking for who might be trying to work against Donald Trump. And you should be afraid.
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