Chapter 1: What is discussed at the start of this section?
the joe rogan experience train by day joe rogan podcast by night all day
How are you, sir? I'm well. Thank you very much. Great to see you, as always. Good to see you, too. You've got a bunch of notes. You've got a lot of things to talk about. We were starting to talk outside. We're like, hold this. Hold these thoughts. Let's bring them in here.
Well, here's where I am. As a criminologist, you know, I take a different approach to things. I'm not obviously a doctor or a scientist. thankfully. And as a criminologist, you get a view of the world that's quite interesting. And so I took a deep dive into pharma.
But I want to put that off for a second, because I know, you know, a lot of these CIA operations like paperclip, where we bring over people who are working on bioweapons from Japan and from Germany, and we Don't prosecute them, and we use them to be the beginning of the U.S. bioweapons program. And I know you know MKUltra and Mockingbird, but do you know the one called Project Gladio?
No, I do not. Put your seatbelt on because this one just tops it all. So this was World War II ends and the OSS, which was the CIA at the time, decides to leave behind rather than take everybody home, all the American soldiers, they're going to leave behind a bunch of them.
Hey, you guys, hide your weapons, hide your rifles, secrete all the grenades and ammunition and put it in bunkers and just sit tight until we have some ideas of things you ought to do. So eventually a few hundred of them stay behind and they are going to do things in Europe to stop communism, to stop socialism, to fight the Soviets, etc.
But what do they actually end up doing is terroristic incidents against our allies. They blow up a train station in Bologna, 285 people injured, 85 people killed, done and funded and operated by our CIA. They do the 1989 assassination of a guy who's a journalist, who's writing about this. They shoot him twice in the head. They do another bombing, 17 people killed.
Another one, Oktoberfest in Germany, not Italy, 17 people killed. Why? Because they see that certain candidates are doing well and might become prime ministers, for example, or important legislators. So when you have a big, giant terrorist incident done in some train station, for example,
That moves the public toward a more right-leaning government or a more totalitarian government that CIA can deal with and away from anything where communism can happen. There's the assassination of Aldo Moro. He was a former prime minister, five bodyguards. They're all killed. He's kidnapped. A few weeks later, he's shot in the head and put in the trunk of a car. That was done by Project Gladio.
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Chapter 2: What are the implications of Project Gladio and CIA operations?
But I want to answer your question about is it just because of no oversight? The United States doesn't end wars very often. For example, World War Two ends and you're all excited about it and you're mounting things and you're doing all this stuff. And then it ends. And everybody's like, hey, but we were really into this thing. And so we don't let them end.
We leave 300,000 troops in Germany, 300,000 troops in Japan, hundreds of thousands of troops in South Korea. Why don't we bring these people home? If the war is over, the war is over. But that's not how empire works. And so the U.S. tends to continue these wars in Japan. The versions I just described to you, which is more secret versions. And it's it's dark, man.
I mean, if somebody and maybe somebody has. But if somebody came into America and did a bunch of terrorist incidents in America that killed a lot of Americans. oh, geez, let's reflect on whether that's ever happened. But anyway, if that happened, we'd be stressed. And rightfully, we'd have a lot to complain about. But it goes on.
And it's kind of my theme for today is sharing these things that are all available on Wikipedia. I'm not making them up. They're all real. And I looked at them from the point of view of a criminologist where I really lay out
The evidence and my purpose, my reason for doing this today with you, also in a book, my reason is that I really want to encourage Americans to be skeptical because if you don't have skepticism, the government runs us. We don't run the government.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
And it's. It's a strange time for that, you know, because first of all, one of the things that happened was the Smith month. Right. So when during the Obama administration, when they made it legal to use propaganda on American citizens, that that blurred the lines completely. of truth and reality for all of us, forever.
Unless that is somehow or another rolled back and I don't see any effort or any desire to roll it back, we're always gonna be stuck in a situation where it's absolutely legal for intelligence agencies to lie to us in the interest of national security.
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Chapter 3: How does Gavin de Becker approach the topic of government oversight?
Of course. And what you see is, look, any suffering that I've done in the last few years personally has been because of my resistance to let go of the illusions and delusions that I grew up with. You know, the courts will be fair. The government will respect our freedom no matter what. The Constitution will be followed no matter what. It's hard to let go of that stuff. It's not easy.
And I still have resistance to it. That's why I look at Gladio, which I just told you about, and I say, holy shit, can you believe this? Well, we have to be able to believe all of it.
Yeah, it's just there's so many layers to it. It's very difficult for regular people. What is a regular person? Regular person is a person who has a job and interest in family and hasn't spent an inordinate amount of time delving into conspiracies and being rational about it and being objective and saying, I know that every fiber of my being rejects this as foolishness and tinfoil hat bullshit.
But is this real? And then the more you find out, oh my God, that is real. The more you find out Operation Northwoods, holy fuck, that's real. The more you find out about these things, MKUltra, you go, wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute. Nobody got arrested for any of this? Nobody went to jail? Nobody got prosecuted? Nobody got tried?
The more you dig into the JFK assassination, the more you dig into everything. And it is a bottomless pit that if you haven't reached the surface of it, you have no idea how much depth there is to it. And that's the normal person. Most people took the shot because they wanted to keep their job.
Or they took the shot because they have to travel to see relatives or they had to visit loved ones in the hospital or whatever the whatever the reason was. They did what they had to do. And, you know, they know people that got fucked up because of the shot. Maybe they got fucked up because of the shot and they feel helpless and they don't know what to do.
But I don't think they understand the depths of, first of all, not just the covid situation. pandemic. But what happened during the AIDS pandemic with the exact same power structure? And when you find that out, I mean, we went over Peter Duesberg's work the other day.
Oh, I'm so glad.
Yeah. And we showed the article in Spin Magazine that was talking about these various doctors that stepped out against the use of AZT and what was going on and how... How evil it was. And the only reason why they were doing it was because these are drugs that had already been approved and they could just push them through quickly. And they were very profitable. All right.
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Chapter 4: How does the conversation connect vaccines to historical events?
I talked to somebody recently who takes care of him. His son takes care of him. I was reaching out to see if he needed anything because I would take care of this guy for the rest of his life. He was a real hero. And they buried him in the ā I mean I don't mean buried him dead.
I mean they stuck him in the basement at Berkeley and he never got another grant, needless to say, in all those years even though he was headed for a Nobel Prize. He was a great thinker. So I didn't ever see the show you did. You did it in 2015?
It was probably even earlier than that. What year was that, Jamie? Okay. It might have been 13 or 14. I don't remember. But I remember a massive pushback.
Like people were very upset. Well, you got you got balls. But I guess you knew that from some other shows because doing it at that time, you know, the insult that goes with that one is AIDS denier. No, no, no. We're seeing AIDS. We're not talking about that. We're talking about whether HIV is always the cause of AIDS.
But there were so many facts that people were ignoring. This is what was ā like for me, when I see a dilemma, I see a situation, and I see inconvenient facts that people are ignoring, one of them being that AZT kills people and that it was a chemotherapy ā medication that they had to stop using because it was killing people quicker than the cancer is killing people.
And that chemotherapy is always a very short term use. It's for short term use. It's like when you have cancer, you take chemotherapy, it kills the cancer and it almost kills you and then you recover from it and hopefully the cancer is gone. This was the only chemotherapy that you were being told to stay on. For life. That had never been. And so it was one AZT killed people for sure.
They were using AZT for AIDS. People were dying from AIDS or AZT, whatever. They were dying more. And they stopped using it and people stopped dying of AIDS. Because that's kind of how it went. Because they'll try to tell you that, oh, no, it's the new medications have stopped the spread of HIV. But why did it never make its way to the heterosexual community?
If it's really a sexually transmitted disease that's so unbelievably contagious that it just spread through the gay community like wildfire. There's a lot of people that had gay sex and straight sex. Well, how come it never really had any meaningful consequences? transition to the heterosexual community. There's a lot of weird shit.
Why do people that were totally asymptomatic, like Arthur Ashe, gets on AZT and he's dead in six months? Is it possible that AZT killed those people and that Peter Duesberg is right? This was my thought. And I'm like, let me hear this guy out. Let me talk to him with a skeptical but objective view. mindset and see where this guy's at.
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Chapter 5: What are the personal experiences with COVID vaccination?
And their friends were saying, why aren't you vaccinated? I thought you loved your kids. Yeah, exactly. Well, they are vaccinated for everything else. But my skepticism on COVID came in waves. Initially, I had zero. Me too.
Chapter 6: How does skepticism about COVID vaccination manifest?
Initially, I almost took it. The UFC allocated 150 vaccines for all of their employees. I'm one of their employees. I showed up. I called the doctor. I said, can I get it today? And they were going to set it up, but then they said, no, actually, we have to give it to you at the clinic. Can you go there on Monday? I said, I can't, but I'll be back in two weeks.
In that two-week time, they'd pulled it from the market. It was a Johnson & Johnson. And then two people that I knew had strokes. That took the vaccine in a two week time. And I'm like, whoa. So then I hit the brakes. And then when they offered it again, I was like, no, I think I'm good. Then my family got it. And then I didn't get it. And I was like, I thought everybody gets it.
You mean got COVID?
Yes.
I mean, everybody got it. I hugged my kids. I had sex with my wife. I tried to get it. I didn't get it. I was like this. She's like, you're going to get it. I'm like, I'm not getting nothing. And I didn't get it. I had two days where I felt crappy. Not crappy bad, but like when I worked out, I didn't feel strong. So what I did was I just worked out with lighter weights.
I did like 35-pound kettlebells. And I just went through a very easy routine where I just got my blood flowing. And then I said, let's see what I feel like the next day.
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Chapter 7: What are the implications of vaccine side effects discussed?
It was like I was running a science experiment on myself. But I was also going crazy because everybody was like locked down. Well, this is ā go. This is live TV, folks. Yeah. So then I realized, okay, well you can contact it and be in contact with someone who's positive and not catch it. Okay, so what is this?
And then Jamie got it and Tony got it, a bunch of our friends got it and they were fine. And my family was fine. My kids got through it like that. That was the nutty thing. Like one of them had like a little bit of a headache and she came home from school and then she tested positive and she was sick for a day, maybe two days with no medication, like nothing.
And then the other one had it for maybe four days. She wasn't feeling so good. And my wife got it a little worse. She got it for about a week. She didn't feel good for about a week.
Chapter 8: How do societal perceptions of vaccines and health evolve?
But it was never scary. It was always like, God, I feel so bad. Is there anything I can get you? Do you want this? Do you want that? But one of the things that we did was IV vitamins, not for the kids, but certainly for me when I got it. And I tell that to everybody when you get sick. If you get sick, get IV high dose vitamin C, get zinc, get vitamin B. Like you will feel so much better.
And if you can tolerate it, get NAD. I know a lot of people like NAD bugs them, freaks them out. It doesn't get in the sun.
Get in the sun.
Yeah, that's true, too.
Which they told us to stay out of the sun. Right. For all of COVID.
If you have access to red light therapy, that's great as well. Well, I think you're a conspiracy theorist. Yeah. Well, I clearly became one. But I mean, the social, the ostracizing of people that have different perspectives was a real thing. And I felt it. And I didn't just feel it from people that I knew, which I did. I felt it from fucking CNN. You know, I felt it from the White House. Yeah.
And I felt it through, but it was kind of cool because it was lies. It was like, oh, you changed the color of my face. You think you're going to get away with this? Like how stupid are you that you don't think people are going to notice? There's a giant difference between my Instagram video where I'm in my backyard just talking normal and then you make me look jaundiced. Yeah.
And there was also the Rolling Stone thing where they showed the people that were waiting in line at the emergency room because so many people were having horse dewormer. Yeah, with gunshot wounds. They were waiting in line. A long line outside. Fucking Rolling Stone. I know.
And they were saying people were getting overdose of horse dewormer, which, by the way, no one got an overdose of horse dewormer. Yeah. Which, by the way, no one's taking. You can get ivermectin online, you fucking idiots. And back then you could get it in a pharmacy until they shut that down. Like, why would you shut down the ability to get a very useful medication? Why would you do that?
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