Show notes
Juliette Fay is the award-winning, best-selling author of tender novels that raise questions of loss, regret, second chances, and the influence families play in life-changing decisions.
Hi, I’m your host, Jenny Wheeler, and on Binge Reading today, Juliette talks about her latest novel, The Half Of It, described by the critics as “an immensely satisfying page turner, perfect for fans of Josie Silver and Jojo Moyes.”
Helen and Cal enjoyed one perfect night, and then 40 years of buried hurt.
They’ve got one chance to make it right. But can the past ever be fixed?
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Links to things mentioned in the show
Books Juliette is reading now:
The Giver of Stars by JoJo Moyes. https://www.jojomoyes.com/books/the-giver-of-stars/
The Exiles by Christina Baker Klein:
https://www.amazon.com/Exiles-Novel-Christina-Baker-Kline/dp/0062356348
Eleanor Oliphant Is Completely Fine by Gail Honeyman https://www.amazon.com/Eleanor-Oliphant-Completely-Fine-Novel/dp/0735220689
Romantic Comedy by Curtis Sittenfeld:
https://www.amazon.com.au/Romantic-Comedy-Curtis-Sittenfeld/dp/0399590943
Where to find Juliette Online
Website: Juliettefay.com
Facebook @JulietteFayAuthor
Twitter, @JulietteFay
Instagram: juliette_fay
Introducing author Juliette Fay
Juliette Fay – tender and touching family stories
But now here’s Juliette. Hello there, Juliette. And welcome to the show. It’s great to have you with us.
Juliette Fay: Oh, it’s wonderful to be here. Thank you so much for having me.
Jenny Wheeler: We’re talking about your latest book The Half of It. It’s a perfectly executed second chance love story. And I wondered right at the beginning, how would you define it in terms of genre fiction? Is it a romance, is it a second coming of age story? How would you classify it?
Juliette Fay: I would classify it as contemporary fiction. It’s not really a classical romance story in that there’s a lot more going on. It’s really about the entire life of the main character Helen Spencer, who’s 58 years old, and it’s about her relationships with her friends and her children.
There is a romance at the center of it, or a potential romance. But I like that phrase, second coming of age. I think that she’s at a point in her life where she really needs to make a course correction and that’s the crux of it.
Jenny Wheeler: It’s interesting as the population in general is growing older, we probably have a little bit more time to regroup, and in fact, it becomes necessary if you’re going to just keep on living to have a chance to regroup, look back on your life, decide whether there are things you would’ve done differently.
Take stock a little bit, isn’t there?
Juliette Fay: Yes, absolutely. And one of the things that was so fascinating to me writing this story is that looking around there aren’t very many books with main characters in their fifties and sixties. It’s very few. I mean, you have to really dig.
It seems that there’s books of characters in their seventies, eighties, and nineties, and then twenties, thirties and forties. I Feel like everybody is in their thirties in most of the books. But your fifties and sixties are such a fascinating time because as you say, you get a second chance to think things through.
Maybe you’re retiring, maybe you have children, and they’ve gone off. I mean, it’s a real turning point. I think it’s such a fascinating life stage. I was fascinated to see that nobody’s picking up on that and so many readers are in their later stages in life.
And we want to read about ourselves, really.
The Half Of It – what does it mean?
Jenny Wheeler: The title, The Half Of is an idiom. I know, from growing up with that phrase, its means something like oh, you don’t know the half of it, and it would seem an interesting title to choose for a book. The general meaning we interpret is it’s actually much worse than you know about, and I wondered why you chose that title and how it relates to the book.
Juliette Fay: I would say that “the half of it “means you don’t know a lot of things. The “half of it” means it’s a much bigger story than you understand. Not necessarily bad, but there’s way more going on here than you know about, when somebody says you don’t know the half of it, there’s way more going on.
And when Helen and Cal meet – should I maybe give a little quick intro about what the book is about?
Helen Spencer is 58 years old and she has just come to the conclusion that her life has not turned out as planed.
She can trace back to where things started going awry to a night that she spent in the woods with a boy that she loved, who loved her. They had this wondrous romantic night in the woods, and then the next day everything blew up and things have been going a little bit wrong ever since.
But she doesn’t want to delve into that. She just wants to keep putting one foot in front of the other. And she hasn’t seen Cal since high school. Then, one day they bump into each other, and Cal tracks her down and he wants to talk about what happened. And, the jacket copy says he doesn’t know the can of worms he’s about to open.
A domino effect from one decision
He doesn’t know “the half of it.” And what he doesn’t know about her, and she doesn’t know about him is what happened in the rest of their lives and how that one night affected them.
Both the domino effect of this one decision and what happened the next day, and how that’s affected both of them.
So they have a lot of catching up to do and they have a lot of working it out to do. I mean, there’s still a lot of hurt and anger from what happened.
Jenny Wheeler: Yes, Helen is recently widowed, not so long ago, widowed, so that’s another part of her life that she’s taking stock of. Her marriage and how successful it really was, or satisfying emotionally, it really was for her.
Do you think that women are inclined to make these reviews of their life a little bit later than men do?
In the earlier years, they’re so consumed with serving other people’s needs. Husbands, children, just keeping things together. If they’re trying to work a job as well, and maybe they find it later in life that they start to look back and want to second guess themselves a little bit.
Juliette Fay: That’s such an interesting point that you make, and I think you’re right about that. I’m, everybody’s different, but men seem to have that classic, midlife crisis at around 40 and, they buy the car or they, whatever, start fly fishing or something like that.
Women maybe ‘take stock’ later than men?
And I think that you’re right, that many women are so busy just trying to keep all the plates spinning in their lives and often in the lives of the people they care about maybe children, maybe a spouse, maybe family members, that they don’t really take that time until maybe later in life when hopefully things quiet down a little bit and they can have that chance to say is this really working out as planned?
Jenny Wheeler: Yes, I did use that phrase ‘second coming of age’ because it seemed to me as I was reading the book, Helen is learning almost for the first time some of the things that are true about her and some of the things that she wants out of life that she hasn’t had already. That’s part of the journey the book takes, isn’t it?
Juliette Fay: It is. It certainly is. I started writing this book in the middle of the pandemic. It was really inspired by that first summer whenever we were all in lockdown and in absence of social connection and going out and doing things.
People seemed to be taking that pause in social interaction to take stock and review and ask themselves important questions. People of all ages were doing this. And I was fascinated by that. They were asking themselves questions like, is this the person I should be with? Or is this the job I really want?
Or should I move closer to my family or should I move further away from my family? What is it that I want from life? And is this it? I’m gonna say to you that I am pretty happy in my life. I’ve been married for 32 years, and I love my husband and I love my kids, and I love my community, and I love my job.
But what if you didn’t? What if you took that reflection and you said, oh, no, this is not where I thought I would be, or, this is not what I want. And Helen really hasn’t taken that look until now. And it’s tough for her because she has been serving others and she has a job she never really wanted.
And she was in a marriage that was lukewarm. She had children early and they consume her, but they’re older now, and so they’re off on their own. And she realizes there were things that she didn’t get that she wanted.
The mother – daughter bonds
Jenny Wheeler: It’s interesting her children, particularly the relationship with her daughter. It’s almost like the daughter now thinks that she’s got more rights than one might consider to tell her mother what to do and to run her life. So even in that respect, she hasn’t quite established her autonomy.
Juliette Fay: That’s really true. So as an oldest daughter myself, and my oldest child is a daughter, we tend to be a little bossy. And one of the things that I really felt… so Helen’s daughter is Barb. And Barb is happy. Barb is doing work that she loves. She has a husband who is wonderful. She’s just adopted a little baby daughter.
I mean, Barb’s life is going pretty great. And one of the things that Helen starts to pick up on is that her children realize that her life hasn’t gone that well and in different ways. They are all trying to avoid her fate.
Juliette Fay: Barb is really the one she’s the closest to. She lives nearby, she takes care of the granddaughter.
And Barb is the one who really is that bossy, oldest daughter who’s saying, mom, you need to change things. You need to be open to things and they really do have a funny. Almost backwards relationship. And yet, Helen is often saying to her daughter, I’m the mother, you’re not the mother, I’m the mother.
But it’s a very loving relationship. Barb nudges her to be happier.
Jenny Wheeler: You’ve got a piece online that you wrote for Psychology Today about writing your way to a happy brain. It was a lovely piece, but it indicates that you might have gone through a similar kind of revision of your life, but at an earlier age. Would you mind talking about that?
It is online for everybody to see.
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Writing your way to a ‘happy brain’ – Juliette Fay style
Juliette Fay: Yes. Right. It’s no big secret. I had my fourth child and I had quit my job. I was working part-time, so I was home with the kids and I was actually quite unhappy. I love my children. I love being with them. But I really felt like I was not using my brain. I used to joke that I was a wiper of spills, a wiper of bottoms, a wiper of noses, like I was a professional wiper.
And I felt very constrained by the fact that I didn’t have anything that was mine. And I tried a bunch of different things, like I knew and my husband knew that I was not happy and I needed to find something. And so I started writing and I describe it it’s a little bit like falling in love.
Like I couldn’t wait to get back to my characters. I couldn’t wait. I was about 40. And it was, I would say, a little midlife crisis of, okay, this is great. I’m very grateful that I have all these little, crazy people running around and my wonderful husband, but it’s still not enough.
I still need something else. And I was able to feed that need with writing. And it’s been a wonderful thing for the last, 20 years.
Jenny Wheeler: I think you say that even if you didn’t get published, you’d still do it. Is that right?
Juliette Fay: Yeah, I really, I, it’s just something I love to do. I can’t tell you how often people say to me, how do you have the discipline to sit in a room and write all day long? And my answer to that is, I don’t need discipline to write. It’s what I love to do. It’s like asking me how I have the discipline to eat a hot fudge sundae.
Like I don’t need discipline, I enjoy it. I need discipline to go to the grocery store and, do the laundry. I don’t need discipline to write. That’s what I like.
What was Juliette’s goal as an author?
Jenny Wheeler: Tell me a little bit about your journey. When you started writing, what was your goal? Did you have a long-term goal, like getting published or at the beginning, were you just simply doing it almost as your personal therapy?
Juliette Fay: I really, I had no idea about getting published, which is funny because I had always been a voracious reader. I have always been somebody who has stories running in my head. I make stories up in my head all the time, But it never occurred to me to really write any of them down. And so once I started doing that, and I wrote my first novel, and I only told a few people I just thought it was such a strange thing you go to a party, well, what are you up to these days?
Well, I’m writing a novel. It just sounded so strange. I really didn’t tell anybody. I was very secretive about it. I did tell a couple of friends who read as I wrote, I would hand them chapters, and at the end they said they really urged me to try and get published.
And so then I went on this journey of trying to figure out what is this publishing world? How does it work, how do I get in? And I have to say I feel that I was very lucky because there are many good books out there that didn’t see the light of day because the author didn’t have the luck of finding.
It’s very hard to get an agent. It’s very hard to get, it’s a tough business and it continues to be a tough business even once you’re in it. So I do feel that I was very lucky to get published.
Commitments to social justice
Jenny Wheeler: One of the books romances, we won’t give anything away by going any further into it than that doesn’t go anywhere, because of the young man’s calling to the priesthood and he keeps this quiet for quite a while so that when he finally ‘fesses up that he’s not going to be going any further with this relationship because of this calling on his life, the young woman is slightly gobsmacked.
I see in your biography, it was just an interesting little hint there that both you and your husband served in Jesuit volunteer programs and social justice initiatives. You both had quite strong commitments in that area.
And I wondered if this was another little area of your life intersecting with your story.
Juliette Fay: So you’re talking about my first book, Shelter Me and yes, absolutely. I worked in the Jesuit Volunteer Corps. I worked in a shelter in Seattle, Washington. My husband worked for legal services in Buffalo, New York, and we both knew many priests because of our work.
And I was fascinated by their lives. And how they could be very kind loving people and yet they kept themselves closed off to any romantic relationship.
It was something that it was interesting for me to explore. And, yes, absolutely, taking a little piece of my faith life.
And putting it, and I think that’s what authors often do. We interject our books with little pieces of things that we are interested in that, that come from our own lives.
None of my books are autobiographical in any way. But I sometimes say they’re autobiographical in a sense that. What the reader sees are the things that I’m interested in, not necessarily things that have happened to me, but themes and conundrums and conflicts and characters and settings that intrigue me.
And so that’s the way in which you’re learning a little bit about me by reading my books.
The ‘chickens come home to roost
Jenny Wheeler: There’s quite a strong sense of morality in them too. And I wondered, generally genre fiction is considered to be for mainly entertainment purposes. Do you have any other thoughts but keeping your readers entertained as your writing?
Juliette Fay: Sure. It’s interesting that you say that morality is big, I don’t know that I would say morality. I would say that my books definitely have a strong theme of giving and volunteerism and being a part of a community and being a generous person. And I think that all of my characters strive to be better than they are.
And that is what I’m interested in. I’m interested in growth. In a character when I read and when I write, I wanna see how the character is gonna get out of this mess and be a better person, toward the end. but first and foremost, I do want it to be entertaining. I don’t want it to be some sort of morality play about how we should all be good.
It really, I mean, there’s a lot of humor in my books. There’s a lot of crazy scenarios. I always say the three things I want a reader to do is laugh, cry, and lose sleep.
Jenny Wheeler: Morality is probably the wrong word. Perhaps integrity is better.
Juliette Fay: Integrity. That’s a good word. Yeah,
Jenny Wheeler: Because some of the things that Cal does as young man lack integrity.
Juliette Fay: That’s true. And he has to speak for that. Those chickens come home to roost and he has to face that even 40 years later. He wants to face it. And I think that’s part of the message of the book is if you have a mess to clean up, if you have an apology to make, if you have some, something to fix in your life.
Now’s the time. You can do that until the day you die. You have that opportunity.
Living life to the full – you don’t know how much time is left
Jenny Wheeler: And I think one of the lovely things is as it develops, they do. make the most of the time that they have, they manage to do that by the end of the novel. They live wholeheartedly, don’t they?
Juliette Fay: Yes, they do. They rekindle their friendship, which is really, as Helen says, the most important thing they ever were, they were friends in high school before that before that romantic night. And their friendship is really the most important thing.
Jenny Wheeler: As we’ve mentioned you have a common theme of women finding agency in their lives and your, this is your seventh novel, but one of the earlier ones, the Tumbling Turner Sisters. Was a best seller described by a critic as a “funhouse take on Little Women.: And that sounded fascinating too.
All of these sisters, tell us a bit about that book. It sounds like it was quite a breakthrough book for you.
Juliette Fay: It really was such a change of pace for me because it was my first historical fiction. The Tumbling Turners Sisters is about a family in 1919, living in upstate New York. Their father is injured and can’t work anymore.
They are facing eviction and their mother, who has always wanted to be on the stage, decides to turn them into a vaudeville act and they become tumblers.
They’re pretty terrible at first. But as their agent, this wisecracking New York agent tells them, pretty girls in short skirts sell, so they go on the road, which is a very unusual thing for young women to do in 1919.
Every week is a different venue, a different town.
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The Tumbling Turner Sisters – a breakthrough book
They travel by train all over the country and it really is a very much an awakening for them.
They come from this little small town in upstate New York and suddenly they’re crossing paths with other performers. Vaudeville, just in case people don’t know, was the nation’s main form of entertainment from the 1880s through the 1920s.
Every small town had a vaudeville theater. And a troop would come into town and it would be a revue of seven to 15 unconnected acts.
Jugglers singers, dancers, comedians, animal tricks, playing the spoons, weird stuff. One of the big hits was Regurgitators.
They would swallow things and then bring them up. Oh, it’s just crazy stuff. It was so fun to research that book.
But you know, as you point out, I am very interested in women’s agency and women learning to take the reins in their own lives, which is very much true in the half of it. Helen really does need to take the reins and make some changes.
And I think that there’s so many ways in which women are often boxed in a little bit by their gender and by the expectations of who they’ll be and how they’ll be. And I like to read stories where women are empowered. So that’s often what I write.
Jenny Wheeler: But you didn’t consciously model the Turner Sisters on Little Women?
20 years in human services influences Juliette’s work
Juliette Fay: I didn’t, but one of the girls does read Little Women in the story and no, honestly, I had gotten halfway through the story and I said, oh, one of them is a big reader and what would she be reading? And I was looking at what kids were reading in 1919.
And Little Women was one of them. I loved Little Women. I must have read that 15 times when I was a kid. And then I was like, wait a minute.
Four sisters in, a difficult time? It’s funny how your brain will weave things together that you’re not looking for, and then suddenly you see the connection and it’s very exciting.
Jenny Wheeler: Turning away from the specific books to your wider career do you think that your life and work experience before you started writing has influenced your work?
Juliette Fay: Oh yes, absolutely. For 20 years I was in human services. I worked predominantly in child abuse prevention and parenting education and childcare and that, family services. I heard so many stories. You learn so much about people when you see them at their neediest.
I don’t use those stories specifically because I don’t wanna take other people’s stories. But I feel like I’ve learned a lot about human nature and the human condition from that work for sure. And I continue, I volunteer at a shelter every week to this day because I really enjoy it.
Jenny Wheeler: If there was one thing that you see as the quote secret of your success, and I guess people are always looking for this secret of success. In your creative career inside of publisher or outside of it, what would it be?
The ‘secret of Juliette’s success’
Juliette Fay: That is such an interesting question. It depends on success at what? Success at publishing books. I mean, like I said, I think, I work really hard to provide a good product, but I’ve been lucky. I think that one of the things that I’m most grateful for is that I did start my career in publishing in my forties.
And I just, like I had a big a pretty big life by that time. it wasn’t the only thing in my life. And so when I get a bad review or somebody would be difficult, I would think, Ugh, okay. I wouldn’t flip out. I see. I think a lot of writers, I mean, you’re, this is something you’ve created.
This is art. This is something that comes from inside of you. And it’s very hard when somebody’s flippantly, disliking it or whatever. And nobody likes a bad review. But I see sometimes other writers, particularly younger writers, getting very upset sometimes about these things. And it’s you know what?
There’s nothing you’re gonna do that. Everyone’s gonna it’s just something you learn as you get older. I think the ability to mostly keep an even keel about things has made it easier for me to stay in this job. And it means easier for me as a human,
Jenny Wheeler: I notice also on your website that you’re very open to chatting with book clubs and all of your books have got book club questions that people can look into or dip into if they’re, if they want to. You are happy to set up talks with them, so I know most of those would be in the us, but just because we do have a slightly wider international audience, can you explain how that works and how people can contact you if they’re interested?
Juliette Fay – available for Book Groups
Juliette Fay: I have to tell you, I love talking to book groups. It’s really fun. It’s very casual. We just chat, whatever you wanna talk about, whatever comments you wanna make or questions you have. And it’s fun to be able to talk about the whole book. Like you and I cannot talk about the ending or spoilers or that kind of thing, but with a book club where everybody’s read the book, it’s really fun to talk about everything.
So I do love doing that. And I have talked with book groups in other countries. Japan. I know I did, recently. So it’s all a matter of timing and making sure it’s, it’s the right time of day when everyone’s awake. You would just go onto my website, julietfay.com.
There’s a contact there, you just email me julietfay.com and tell me when you’re thinking about having your meeting. And then I zoom, I would just Zoom with the group and sometimes the whole group is on Zoom or sometimes the group gets together at someone’s house and then I’m on Zoom and the, the rest of ’em are on the other side.
Yes, very much happy to do that. With anyone, so I encourage that.
Jenny Wheeler: That’s fabulous. But because this is The Joys of Binge Reading, we do like to ask you about your reading taste, and particularly whether you’ve ever been a binge reader as such.
What are you reading now and what do you like to recommend to listeners?
Juliette Fay: Absolutely. I am a big audio book listener. I’m an obsessive gardener and I love to listen to a book while I’m weeding or planting things or digging rocks outta my garden. Or driving, I do a lot of driving, so that’s another time when I really love to listen to books.
It’s important to me that not only is the book good, but the narrator is good. And there’s some narrators that I love and I’ll listen to a book just because of the narrator. The books that I enjoy the most are probably historical fiction and women’s fiction, relationship fiction, family drama, that kind of thing.
What Juliette is reading now
Two of the best audiobooks for historical fiction that I’ve listened to recently with great narrators is The Giver of Stars by JoJo Moyes. I loved that, and The Exiles by Christina Baker Klein. I love quirky characters.
In terms of contemporary fiction, I loved Eleanor Oliphant is completely fine that I loved. And most recently I just finished listening to Romantic Comedy by Curtis Sittenfeld It is a romance, but it’s deep. It really gets into how this woman looks at her life.
She’s in some ways a little bit like Helen. She’s a little repressed and – not repressed, but she doesn’t think that she’s going to find real love in her life, and it’s a very fun story. All of those I can recommend highly.
Jenny Wheeler: Fabulous. The Curtis Sittenfeld one has attracted my attention. I haven’t had a chance to look at it yet, but I have read some of the earlier books and they were great too.
Looking back down the tunnel of time, if there was one thing about your creative career you’d changed, what would it be?
Juliette Fay: Oh, that is so interesting. That’s a really interesting question. Oh, I would’ve been on Oprah or something, I guess, but I feel like, given that it’s a very tough industry, it’s very hard to get in. It’s very hard to stay in, I feel pretty lucky that I’ve been able to stay in for seven books.
And I’m proud of the books that I’ve written. And I feel good about that. I don’t know, I guess I don’t really have any regrets about my career. Maybe I should come up with some just to be more interesting, but I guess I don’t.
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What Juliette has on her desk for next 12 months
Jenny Wheeler: I think having started at 40 a lot of people who do start writing just a bit later in life regret they didn’t start earlier, but you’ve got the advantage there
Juliette Fay: If I’d started any earlier, I don’t think that I would’ve been as good at it, honestly. I just feel like I had so much more life under my belt. In my twenties and thirties I was very busy with a career and children and all kinds of things, and I don’t regret starting earlier. I think that I was able to bank a bunch of interesting life experiences that helped me be a better writer in my forties.
Jenny Wheeler: Looking forward to the next 12 months in your life as a writer, what have you got on your desk that you’re working on or that you’re thinking about?
Juliette Fay: Well, I have another book that I finished and we’re seeing what editors are out there My editor retired, so I’m looking for a new editor.
My agent is working on that. I have that historical fiction that I haven’t quite finished and I’m thinking I’m gonna go back to that.
Honestly, I think I’m going take the summer off. I need to let the well fill up a little bit. So I’m going to just garden a lot and do some traveling and see my children and stuff like that. Fun stuff. Go to the beach and then see where we’re at, maybe in September.
Jenny Wheeler: I’m interested in the garden because I’m a gardener. Tell me a little about your garden. What Zone are you in and what sort of garden do you have?
Where to find Juliette Fay online
Juliette Fay: I’m in Zone six and I do not have full sun in any place in my yard, so I do a lot of shade. I have probably 20 varieties of hostas. I’m a big astilbe fan. I love epimediums. There’s something I love about just getting dirty and being out there .
Jenny Wheeler: I think that’s wonderful to be dedicated to a shade garden because they in some ways are harder, aren’t they?
Juliette Fay: They are hard, they’re not as flashy but they can still be very beautiful. And for me it’s like a big art project. It’s like a big canvas and I get to paint it, however I want. So, I enjoy it.
Jenny Wheeler: That’s gorgeous. You had mentioned about emailing through your website. Do you enjoy interacting with your readers and where is the best place for them to find you online?
Juliette Fay: Oh, I do love it, I really do. It’s funny, many writers are introverts, they just like to be alone in a room with their imaginary friends, and I do love that, but I am a big extrovert, so I love communicating with people. I am on Facebook at JulietteFayAuthor, I’m a on Twitter, Juliette Fay.
I’m on Instagram. I really enjoy posting pictures on Instagram so that, and people can always reach me by email and I do answer, it’s so funny.
Every once in a while somebody will write to me and I write back and they say, I can’t believe you wrote me back. And I’m like, well, you took the time to write to me, so of course I’m gonna answer you.
So yeah, I do like that.
Jenny Wheeler: That’s lovely. Juliet, look, thanks so much for your time. It’s been a delight to talk.
Juliette Fay: Oh, I thank you so much. It’s been really fun.
If you enjoyed Juliette- you might also enjoy Karen White – Hope in Darkness
Karen White’s The Last Night in London, is a time slip story moving between the present day and wartime London. You set up a web of fascinating links between two women, one a fashion journalist in 1940s London, and the other a New York photojournalist in the present day.
LISTEN TO KAREN
Next week on Binge Reading
Jenny Wheeler: Next week on Binge Reading, Amy Poeppels, and her fresh and funny fourth romcom, The Sweet Spot.
Three woman, Lauren, Olivia and Melinda, all with totally different motives, and at the beginning, not necessarily good motives, are drawn into caring for baby Horatio. It’s described as a “love letter to family friendships and Greenwich village.”
That’s next week on Binge Reading. Just before we go, remember, leave us a review if you enjoy the show, so others will find us too. That’s it for today. See you next time.