First Person Medicine with Dr. Susan Nathan and Thor Ringler
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What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
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At the Nocturnus, we are careful to ensure that all stories comply with healthcare privacy laws. Details may have been changed to ensure patient confidentiality. All views expressed are those of the person speaking and not their employer.
This is the Nocturnous Conversations. I'm Emily Silverman. Today I'm joined by Dr. Susan Nathan, a palliative care physician at the Boston VA, and Thor Ringler, a therapist, poet, and longtime storyteller at the Madison VA. Together, they lead My Life, My Story, a simple yet revolutionary program that invites veterans to share their life stories in their own words. Volunteers sit down with veterans for in-depth, open-ended interviews, carefully write up their stories in the first person, and then read the narratives back for the veterans' approval. Once finalized, these stories are added to the medical chart, where clinicians can access them and see the person behind the patient. In my conversation with Susan and Thor, we explore how a small idea in Madison grew into a national program across 80 VA sites, the art of deep listening and writing stories that truly reflect a person's voice, and how these narratives are changing the way clinicians see and care for their patients.
I hope you enjoyed this conversation as much as I did. But first, let's hear Susan read one of the first-person narratives from the My Life, My Story program. Here's Susan.
I was born in Panama as the second of six boys. If you include half siblings from my father, you would get all the way up to twelve boys and two girls. My mother has been a teacher for as long as I can remember, and still, even at eighty years old, she is a teacher. Three of my brothers came to the United States in the late eighties, and I, along with my two remaining brothers, came shortly after them, along with my mother. Initially we were here on student visas, but quickly obtained green cards. Rather than waiting for the long process of naturalization as a civilian, I decided to join the military. On the day I was naturalized, I was a part of the National Guard and was on the USS Kennedy in Massachusetts.
My naturalization card was handed to me by none other than Senator Ted Kennedy. When it came time to celebrate everyone's American citizenship. Senator Kennedy handed me a sword to cut the cake. Shortly before I was scheduled to go to Iraq, a private was carving a stick with a knife as I walked by. It first felt as if someone slapped my hand, but when I looked down to see what had happened, his knife had flown out of his hand and stuck into mine. When I pulled the knife out on instinct, I lacerated three tendons. Because of this I required three surgeries and was unable to go to Iraq. When my friends returned, they made fun of me for my lack of combat experience. To show them that I could fight too, I immediately signed up for active duty.
I chose to be stationed in Hawaii. Shortly after arriving, I was chosen at random to be assigned to Fort Shafter to serve the general as his driver. I think the branch forgot that I existed because I ended up staying there for six years. Unfortunately, while in Hawaii, I had a very challenging experience with a sergeant that has shaped much of my life since.
What is the My Life, My Story program and why was it created?
The sergeant made my life a living hell and put me on his list of bad soldiers that he sent to the oncoming captain. Since I was labelled a bad soldier. I was constantly berated and treated poorly. Unfortunately, due to a miscommunication with my sergeant, I quickly found myself in even more trouble. When I tried to explain to the platoon leader what had happened, my sergeant and captain overheard my conversation. And said I would be fired from the army for disrespecting them. For the next several months I was constantly walking on eggshells. I was so overcome by the stress and anxiety of the situation that I became suicidal. When I went to seek help from the military therapist on the base, my problems were dismissed because I had never been in combat.
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Chapters
4 chapters
1
What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
0:00–3:31
2
What is the My Life, My Story program and why was it created?
3:31–8:10
3
How did the first veteran narrative illustrate the power of first‑person storytelling?
8:10–29:33
4
What are the professional backgrounds of Susan Nathan and Thor Ringler and how did they become involved?
29:33–34:26