Chapter 1: What is discussed at the start of this section?
George Campbell here with a quick PSA before the calls start coming in. If you want to leave the money stress in 2025, you need a plan that works. So take what you learned today and put it to work in every dollar. Download the app and start for free today. Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life.
From the Ramsey Network and the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio, this is The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by my pal and co-host on Smart Money Happy Hour, another great show on the Ramsey Network, Rachel Cruz is here with us as well. We're here to answer your calls about life and money. The number is 888-825-5225. Miguel kicks us off in Dallas, Texas. What's going on, Miguel?
Hey, George. How you doing? Doing great. How can we help today? Yeah. Hey. So, you know, I've been following you guys for quite a bit sometime now. I kind of wish I'd started earlier, like most people, but well. 100%. Same. Here we are. You know, I'm working on step number six, thankfully. But I do have a question because I listened to...
They say all the time how credit cards are the devil and they are the worst thing that one person can use. And I agree with all of that, except so. A really long time ago, kind of like Dave, at a very young age, I did bankruptcy. And since then, I learned to live within my means. But I've had a lot of credit cards since then. I just paid them off at the end of the month.
i don't have any credit card debt i haven't had for over 10 15 years now good so my question is um you know if i pay off my credit cards at the end of the month and i am using them a lot so that i can get like you know free tickets to travel with my family and stuff like that uh would you still recommend that i don't do that uh if so why or is it okay for me to continue using my credit cards as long as i pay them off
Well, as of this recording, it's still a free country. So you are free to do as you wish, Miguel. And so is it okay? Sure. If it's working for you, go for it. But the reason you called in, there's something inside of you that maybe is thinking, is there a better way? Could I be doing better?
Could I optimize if I use my own money instead of using someone else's and paying it back every month later on? Sure, you could make the argument in hypotheticals all day long, but the real thing here is you're using it to get free travel, correct? Did I hear that right? Yeah, correct.
And so have you actually added up what it would have cost you if you had paid cash, done your own research, found the right flights that work for your family? Like, okay, I got $600 in value out of this, and it cost me $200 for the card for the year. Have you done the math on that? Yeah, I mean, it definitely pays off.
Like, for example, last year I took my family to Europe and I completely paid for our flight tickets. It was $4,000 worth just with points. I had to pay a little bit of tax on it. How much did you spend? Oh, you said you had to pay it off the balance the next month? No, no, that was just paid off with points. Okay. You said you owed a little bit still for the flights is what you meant. Okay.
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Chapter 2: How should I approach using credit cards responsibly?
And we actually ended up spending less. we don't even know how that happened. And I'm like, well, cause I know because there's no emotional. So you don't even realize the amount of money that you're actually overspending. So over years of spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on this credit card to get $4,000 of flights,
What could have been saved actually may have been even more than $4,000 with the subconscious spending that you're doing and not even realizing it. So that's one thing. And then number two, Miguel, and again, this is a personal kind of conviction for me, and it may not be for you. I'm not saying it has to be for everyone.
But what's so frustrating to me, and I think because we're in this line of work, and George and I talk to people every single day who do have credit card debt, and these banks and this whole debt industry has screwed over the American people. They have. They have not helped people. They have hurt people. That's why we have a job.
And because of that, the people that are hurting, the single moms that are calling in that have $11,000 in credit card debt and they're trying to get out or it's the families who lost, like people that are struggling and they are in credit card debt and they're the ones paying the fees, they're the ones paying the interest, they're the ones making the bank rich to get people like you to get free points and free flights.
So off the, I mean, it kind of feels like off the backs of people who are struggling and hurting. I don't want a free flight out of that. I have the ability to save up and work hard myself and not have to deal with this industry at all. And there's, and I have no bill at the end of the month. You know what I mean? Like I pay for my groceries.
Sometimes I do Instacart and have them delivered and then it's done. And then I'm done. And I'm like, I don't have to, I don't have to play this game with them. And so there's just something so freeing about it. And again, that may not be everyone's conviction, but when I see banks and I see their bill, all the things, I'm just like, well, yeah.
And I'm just like, man, y'all have screwed over people and people are giving their hard earned income
to these places to these industries and they're not allowing to be able to help themselves you know and so i'm like i don't i don't want it i don't want it i will save up i'm i'm booking a girl's trip actually today i was telling george i was gonna buy some tickets and i'm like i will go on southwest and buy my i think it's 196 dollars one way you know and i'm like that's fine i will budget for that like all day every day
And I don't have to worry about it. I don't know, Miguel.
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Chapter 3: What are the potential downsides of using credit cards for rewards?
whole nine yards there, but I asked her to get a part-time job during the summer next semester to kind of get some financial freedom away from her parents.
But if you're in her shoes, why would you work part-time?
Because hopefully you have the character to say, I'm an adult and I'm going to start making adult-like decisions. And now it's showing that her character isn't there.
Yeah, that was my tester to see if she was willing to put in some effort because I'm I want to make things work, but if I'm expected to take 100% of the financial burden for the next 50 years, I don't know if I can handle that.
Right. And it's not even like a situation, Derek, where she's working and she's like, hey, but when I become a mom, I want to be full-time at home and I want my job to be that. I want to transfer home and be a full-time mom. But there's no initiative at all in who she is. And what always that fear is to me is, is that it starts to bleed into other areas of your life.
You know what I mean of this procrastination?
Just apathy.
Apathy or laziness. Lack of purpose. I don't know what it is, but I'm like, man. Yeah, it's just not a lot of attractive qualities that come out of that. And I'm not saying that she needs to go be some corporate woman climbing the ladder and working 80 hours a week. It's not even that. But it's just like, yeah, I want the dignity to have my own money. I'm 26. I'm 26.
And I've been in school for, what, eight years?
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Chapter 4: How can I build financial discipline while managing spending?
I never even noticed that stuff. George is like the Apple guy. And he's like, hey, is that the iPhone model 4?
This is from a former Apple store employee.
I know. And listen, the guy in the lobby with the phone, he's doing great. He's thriving. He's living a great life.
Thriving.
He's fine. So you can buy a cheaper phone if you need to. All's going to be okay.
I feel like these installment plans also have caused like cell phone inflation because the cell phone companies, like we can charge whatever. They'll just put it on payments.
Yes.
So it's part of the problem and it causes you to get into a cycle where it's like a gateway drug to other payments. If you're okay with this payment, why not buy now, pay later?
Right.
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Chapter 5: What are the benefits of using NetSuite for financial management?
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Welcome back. Going to the phones. We have Sarah in Riverside, California. Hi, Sarah. Welcome to the show. Hi, thank you for having me. Absolutely. How can we help? So I have some guilt and pride around using child support money. So I was in an abusive relationship, and by the grace of God, I was able to leave when my son was about three weeks old.
I met my now husband when my son was six months old, and he's now 12. Um, my husband and I had sat and talked and said, we don't want any money. We don't want anything. We want nothing to do with him. Well, the judge made the decision that it's not our choice and it's not our money. Um, it's for our son. So we were just putting all that money in an account.
Um, we had some debt and, um, in 2021, I lost my job and we needed four walls. So we dipped into that account. As of January of 2025, we are officially done with Baby Step 2. We are completely debt-free. Oh, congratulations. Thank you. It's very exciting. I'm really happy to be there. But I have about $4,000 from that child support money that we said we'd never use.
And I'm wondering if I should just pay it back like a debt and just keep going like if we were on Baby Step 2 or...
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Chapter 6: How can I effectively use child support money?
the connotation of the child support money in the first place just killed me. And I don't know what to do about it. So this guilt, Sarah, I'm just double checking that the facts are correct. You didn't use this money immorally. It was more of a conviction that you personally had with it because of who it came from.
And you just, the thought of using it just feels gross and you had to use it at one point. But from a legal standpoint, you used it exactly how anyone else would use it, right? To help run the household because you're taking care of a child and that other parent is helping with that, correct? Exactly. Yeah.
And what was the court order? How much and for how long?
It was originally it was until he was 18 and it was supposed to be $430. The only money that I've actually seen from that is the COVID money. I was able to get his COVID check. I didn't know that it was coming. My husband adopted our son when he was four years old. Everything finalized. So that's when the child support stopped.
But there's so much arrears that, I mean, I will still randomly get, like, a $12 check.
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Chapter 7: What should I do with leftover child support funds?
Okay, so it's over, essentially.
You're not getting future payments. You just have this kind of savings sitting here, and you feel like, I don't want to touch this money because it feels weird.
Yeah, how much is in that account? In the account right now is... $2,000, and I used four of it. Four of it. And what are you going to do with it eventually? Are you going to give it to him when he's 18? Or help pay for a car when he's 16? Or college? Or what do you think? That's what we were thinking. Just a car or something like that.
Like I said, my husband's been around since my son was six months old. So my son doesn't know. He doesn't know any different as of right now. And eventually we're going to tell him. I mean, we have to tell him, but we're just not there yet. He's not...
emotionally mature enough to be there yet sure okay um so what I'll speak to I'll speak to the money side of it Sarah from the sense that no this is not a debt that you need to pay I mean you're you use the money essentially how the system works and you know you use it exactly appropriately and I know that doesn't sit well with you because of who it's coming from and that
That totally makes sense to me. But I think kind of the quote-unquote debt going forward, which is not a debt, but it's to say, okay, how can we best set up my son to have a life where he, from a financial standpoint, understands money, doesn't have to walk through this debt-free journey, and we're setting him up in order to do that.
And that looks like things like maybe college or helping with his first car, whatever that may look like for you guys and for me. I wouldn't hold on to that emotional $4,000 anymore because I think you need to release that. But I think going forward, the motivation now is to pass a great legacy onto your son, right? Regardless of $4,000 or not.
So I totally understand how that can feel like, oh my gosh, we use this money and it feels so gross and I hate it because he's a terrible person. Um, but on, but you know, you, you guys were in a pinch at the time and that's what that money's for is to help take care of your son. And that's what you guys did.
So, um, I, I would, I would let go of that because emotionally, I think it, I think it is holding onto you so deeply.
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Chapter 8: How does emotional attachment to money influence financial decisions?
Instead of child support money from an abusive, awful relationship, this is changing my family tree money to set up my child for a better life than the one I experienced.
Yeah, and Sarah, too, you know, give yourself a little bit of grace. You know, if this was a $60,000... you know, thing or something. And you were like, oh my gosh, she was supposed to use it for a down payment on a house or, you know what I mean? Like a mag, like, I feel like, like a, like a lot of this magnitude and weight from a dollar standpoint, I feel like we could go at it a different way.
Cause I could see, you know, the more money it is, the more weight it feels right. So, um, so with this 4,000, yeah, I, I want you, I want you to release it for you, Sarah. Again, it's not about the dollars at that point to me. It's, it's that emotional attachment that's still there to him. Um, And I want that. I want that release from you, you know, so whatever that looks like.
I would have a goal for this money instead of letting it just sit there. It's only going to make, you know, reopen the wound. So I would put it in a 529 plan for college. I would put it toward in a savings account for a car fund one day because that day is going to come. And these things cost money. And this is it's part of the deal.
And, you know, there's a shared burden because that person was a parent and this is what the court ordered. And so it's hard to just say, release the guilt, Sarah, you're doing great. But that's the truth of it. It's that hard and it's that simple to just go, all right, it happened. That was the past. And I'm going to make a better future for my kid now. And it sounds like you guys are thriving.
And this child is so lucky to have you two. Yeah, he's definitely blessed.
My husband is literally a godsend, and he took him on like his own. And like I said, nobody knows. There's a couple people like family knows, but he doesn't know. And my husband stepped up in more ways than I could ever even pray for.
Well, and give yourself to so much credit, Sarah, because we we talked to so many people on this show and women specifically that are in in a situation and they just they don't feel like there's a way out. And whether from its financial type abuse where, you know, a husband's withholding and not allowing controlling. Yes. To physical, emotional. I mean, you know, you can fill in the gaps.
The spectrum is wide.
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