Show notes
Welcome to an audio-led edition of Unmade.Today’s edition features an interview with Disrupt Radio’s chief commercial and innovation officer, Rob Shwetz. We left the interview with almost as many questions as we went in, but perhaps with a better sense of what Australia’s newest radio network does not want to talk about.Tim Burrowes writes:I find business fascinating. I adore startup stories. And I’m a media nerd. So I should be absolutely in love with the story of Disrupt Radio, which combines all three.The network launched last month, online, and with DAB+ licences in Sydney, Melbourne and Brisbane.But the more I find out, the more sceptical I become. For a radio network using public airwaves, there’s a lot of undisclosed information about its ownership.Listening to today’s interview with Rob Shwetz, chief commercial and innovation officer at Disrupt Radio, may leave you with almost as many questions as you had before you started. However, the conversation should help you understand why I’m puzzled by so much of the Disrupt Radio launch.Unless you work in the media industry, I wouldn’t blame you if you have missed the story of Disrupt Radio so far. I certainly wouldn’t be expecting many listeners to have yet had the awareness to tune in. There’s been some publicity, but I haven’t seen any paid ads looking to attract an audience, although the company says it has done some outdoor.The best known presenters are Enterprise Breakfast host Libbi Gorr and Startup Nation host Jules Lund. Thinkerbell’s Adam Ferrier is a weekly co-host on Gorr’s show, while another ad industry stalwart Siimon Reynolds presents The Business Lounge.Among the curious things about Disrupt Radio is that the management won’t say who its financial backers are. In the interview, Shwetz claims not to know, despite having worked alongside Roberts on the launch for the past five years.Given that there’s a staff of about 20, that suggests an annual cost base of at least $2m, and probably more.I suppose it’s in keeping with Disrupt Radio’s communications strategy, which Schwetz describes in the interview as “PR by stealth”.Similarly, Shwetz says he has no idea what the marketing budget is for the station during this current financial year already under way. To be clear, marketing is one of his responsibilities.Schwetz’s previous background has included director of client strategy at Fairfax Media’s client content arm, Made. And he also spent five years as group strategy director of Mediacom in Sydney. Earlier in his career, he lists six years as strategy director for brand, media and creative at Publicis.Yes, it’s a fast-moving startup (albeit one five years in the planning), but he is the person in charge of marketing. Most CMOs would know by now what their budget for FY24 is.There are other things which are a puzzle. Did wealthy (and busy) former rock star Bob Geldof really travel over from the UK and spend a week in Melbourne co-presenting the breakfast show with Libbi Gorr just out of his love of the radio medium? That feels a little unlikely, despite Shwetz’s insistence that it’s the case. “There’s nothing more than him coming and loving the medium”.Similarly, one of the hitherto less commented-upon presences on the daily lineup is UK polemicist Rod Liddle, who interviews entrepreneurs for a daily show called Global Disruptors (or perhaps Disrupters; they spell it both ways on the Disrupt website).Liddle is a great get. It’s strange they’ve done so little to promote this. Liddle is a massive name in UK media. He was a hugely controversial (and successful) editor of BBC Radio 4’s flagship Today program, and currently writes for News Corp’s daily tabloid The Sun and broadsheet The Sunday Times, along with influential right wing weekly The Spectator. He writes beautifully. Yet they haven’t mentioned him. It would be like Andrew Bolt popping up on a hospital radio station in the UK and nobody thinking that seemed comment-worthy.Could it be that there are UK investors involved in the station? Maybe even Geldof, most prominent globally for his role in creating Live Aid, but he’s also been an investor in media ventures. Shwetz says not.Shwetz declines in the interview to name any investors. Incidentally, since recording the podcast, I’ve emailed Disrupt Radio to ask that question directly.Perhaps sports radio minnow Sports Entertainment Network, run by Craig Hutchinson, has a stake. The DAB+ licences came from SEN, Shwetz said during the interview, and staff work from their offices. “It’s quite a close commercial and working relationship with SEN”.Shwetz also declines in the interview to share how listening numbers have been via streaming so far, although he claims they have exceeded expectations.He makes an ambitious statement about the network’s aims for audience, saying the company aims to hit a weekly cumulative reach of 250,000 to 300,000. That would be about the same as ABC Radio National.Not that Shwetz would commit to signing up to the ratings system, claiming that they haven’t had time to think about it. Remember, this is a startup five years in the making.I wonder what level of data they will provide to early sponsors, who include Telstra and GWM.To be clear, this interview was not a case of catching the wrong person unawares. When the PRs for Disrupt Radio proposed Shwetz for the interview, rather than Benjamin Roberts who we had been asking to talk to for months, we questioned whether he’d be qualified. We sent through examples of four podcasts I’d previously recorded with other start ups and media bosses to give a sense of the topics I ask about, in case they were not regular listeners.They replied: “We've put Rob up for this because he's actually more suited to your audience, as he is head of marketing, advertising and media relations. He's worked alongside Ben to develop and launch the company over the past 5 years which was how the station was founded.”With Roberts off the table, we decided to go ahead with the Shwetz interview.This may be a slightly frustrating read, because you may have got to this point feeling like you know less than you did at the beginning. Give it a listen and decide for yourself.In all our podcasts, I finish by asking our guest what their supporters say about them, and what their detractors say. Shwetz’s reply was: “The critics are saying they’re going to give us six months.”Fair enough.For the record, I’d still love to talk to Benjamin Roberts.Audio production was courtesy of Abe’s Audio, the people to talk to about voiceovers, sound design and podcast production.Message us: [email protected] This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit unmade.substack.com