What do designers do after they've achieved their career goals? Why aren't designers typically founders, and why is creative burnout so common? In this episode, I sit down with Joel Beukelman (Designer at Google) for a raw and honest conversation about career growth, goal attainment, and the inevitable existential crisis that follows. We touch on the dangers of being emotionally attached to work, the prevalence of ego and homogeneity in design, and the confusing world of design titles and roles (and how they impact us). Plus, Joel shares his framework for evaluating one's career and its impact on life. "I had to look outside of design in my career and be like, 'There has to be something more than this, because this obviously isn't fulfilling or making me feel purposeful'. In the end, I had a meeting with Monica, my manager, and she was like, 'What do you want next?' and I was like, 'I want to work less. I want to be here less. Can we do that?' It was a weird conversation to have with my boss, but that was really it. I didn't want to invest my time in my career." — Joel at 9:55 Please note that this was recorded well before the COVID-19 pandemic, in October of 2019. Check out the video that Joel made about this interview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QtUeQvp9b8M Try his framework for yourself: https://www.bkl.mn/designer-at-scale Joel on Twitter: https://twitter.com/_bklmn Joel on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/joelbeukelman Joel on Instagram: http://instagram.com/bklmn Austin on Twitter: https://twitter.com/ustinknight More about me and the show: https://austinknight.com/

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