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Chapter 1: What is discussed at the start of this section?
It's Gerard Waitley. Thanks for listening to the podcast. In this episode, the art of coaching with Ken Hinckley, Greg Swan in the studio for a long-form chat at the midpoint of the AFL season, the Bulldogs' Cody Waitman having made his return to footy, the eminently sensible Phil Davis, Brad Blanks from New York, and Nerdy Stats with Peter Blucher. You can get in touch at any time.
Waitley at sen.com.au. Thanks for listening. Enjoy. Wednesday morning. This is your town. This is your station. This is Waitley. Good morning. A little bit of reflection today from the Hall of Fame inductions last night and the state funeral of Neil Danaher this afternoon. Greg Swann is going to come into the studio at 10. We'll have the long form conversation.
So we'll give a whole hour over to this, particularly in the back portion. We'll talk about the umpiring. So just to set the terms, I'm not going to yell at him about the umpiring and I'm not going to read your texts or the snap judgments from it. But let's see if we can... find some middle ground on what's happening with the umpiring at the moment where the adjustments might be made.
So Greg will be here at 10 for the hour. The eminently sensible Phil Davis is 11. We've given him the project of Collingwood on and off the field for the next little bit. Bulldog Cody Waitman, he's on his way to training at Witten Oval. He's made his comeback. He's preparing for his second game, so tomorrow night against Adelaide.
So back in the flow of his footy career, probably part two of it from here, and we start our Wednesdays with the art of coaching with Ken Hinckley. So we're absolutely stacked. The 40 Wings temper text is 0433 98 11 16. The difference is temper. From the wheat fields and gold mining towns of remote WA to the most decorated player in the state's history, a vision from the Tiwi Islands.
Almost a myth. Such were his deeds. A trek that could barely be comprehended and a career that could only be really appreciated by those who saw it and recall it. A thousand goal kicker from the glory days of Port Adelaide. The defining figure in West Coast's history. The umpire who heard the silent siren in Launceston.
A child of Windy Hill who fancied a career in tennis and had never played fullback until he reached the big league.
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Chapter 2: What reflections are made on the Hall of Fame inductions?
and the son of a great who fancied himself as a professional surfer before amassing the greatest CV of the modern era, the 2026 Australian Football Hall of Fame inductees.
My training during those early days was my wife in an old ute I had. She'd drive the ute. I'd have a rope around my middle here tied to the back of the ute and she'd just go along at a certain speed and I'd be telling her to slow down or whatever it was. If we'd had an argument the night before it wasn't too good.
Every time I went to footy training, I wore a North Melbourne Guernsey with number four on the back. You know, then all of a sudden, as a 17-year-old, I've signed up with this new club, and they introduced me to the first inaugural captain, and that was Rosslyn Denning, whose Guernsey I'd been wearing for nearly 10 years.
That was my early days. I just was thinking, I don't belong here. But I'm going to give it a crack. Special, special year. You know, some of the boys in that side, I think we only lost the one game. And I was partly to blame for that. I think the ball came off my shin and Chris Grant swung around and kicked the winning goal. But Sheeds blames me, but I blame him.
I reckon he was outcoached by Terry Wallace that day.
Thinking back to some of those drives home from the MCG where I'd call my dad feeling as though I'd had a great game and dad would remind me that none of my highlights from today's game would get on his highlights tape. LAUGHTER
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Chapter 3: What insights are shared about coaching and umpiring?
And every now and then we'll reflect back on our career and, you know, everything we were able to achieve. I know, you know, we get compared a lot. I think we're very different players. And I don't like to compare players. I think, you know, each player brings something to the game that maybe another player doesn't. And Dad could do things that I couldn't.
And I got to win a Brownlow, which he didn't. And that'll settle most debates. How lovely. John Worsfold, Ross Glendennings, Guernsey, Gary Ablett, Ken Hinckley's number. Hello to you, Kenny. Good morning, Gerard. What a great night it was. And well done to yourself on a great part of the show, the interviewing and the stuff that went on.
I just, you know, luckily enough to get to tune into a little bit of it at the end. So they're always a fantastic night, aren't they, the Hall of Fame, when you reflect on people's careers and what they've been able to do. One thing it did tell me that father and sons have been important in football, haven't they? Have they ever. When you think about Geelong and Gary Ablett Jr.
and Dustin at Essendon, they have played a part. And that's why I like the father and son part of the draft. But I've talked about this a bit. It becomes too compromised if you allow different things in. But it was good to see, particularly for me, to see Gary up there immediately put into the Hall of Fame was such a great night.
So tell us about your connection to Gary because it takes us right back to the start. Yeah, it does. I went back to Geelong as an assistant coach in 2004 when Gary had just started out his playing career, but before then when I played with his dad.
I remember the two boys, Gary and Nathan, they'd get on the bus and they'd come up to their games with us because we would travel up on a bus to the games in Melbourne or to the MCG or wherever they might be. And one of the property stewards would give the boys ā they'd get off the bus with a couple of packets of chewing gum, Jerry. That's what they'd get.
They'd get a couple of packets of chewing gum. And we'd see them back at the bus when we were going home. And you think about what you do with your children today and how you look after them and you wouldn't let ā
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Chapter 4: How does Cody Waitman feel about his return to footy?
Those two boys would just go to the footy. They'd be in the rooms. They'd be kicking the footy around and competitive. I can even remember them as kids being fiercely competitive and the way they used to go about it. And then... And, you know, you play with dad and then you get an opportunity to coach the son. So it's just an amazing journey to have been a part of.
And when you're reading, particularly Gary's resume out last night, I mean, it was staggering. You just kept reading and you kept reading and you kept reading. And this is a young man that when I first went back to the coach, he was nowhere near sure of who he was and what he was. and it took him a little while to figure that. He was a wonderful person, always a caring person.
Do anything for anyone and make sure everyone else was probably being looked after as well as anyone. But then his footy deeds, I mean, goodness. I mean, I was lucky in 2004 he was playing as a forward. I was coaching the forwards at Geelong. I had Chapman, Ablett, Johnston, some remarkable players, but Junior was the best.
I mean, you know, Stevie will be listening in and he'll be grumpy that I said Junior was the best, but Junior was the best. And then he went on and carried the... Basically, I don't want to say he was the sole and only reason that Geelong Football Club became the Geelong Football Club of today. But, gee, he played a pretty big part in it with that team that we had in 2007 and on.
It set up the dynasty of Geelong as I know it today and everyone knows it as of today. And, you know, it was remarkable. Gary was such an important figure. And, you know, the stories that go on. around Gary and, you know, the leading teams' conversations around you can be our best player. And they're somewhat close to the truth.
Gary was basically asked, you know, you could be our Chris Judd and you should be our Chris Judd. You know, and he became that and more. You know, and then I go to the Gold Coast in 2010. Well, Gary joins me in 2011. Yes. So in some ways... our journeys have been very aligned. And then I left, obviously, up there. And his record at the Gold Coast, oh, goodness. That team had no players.
A lot of young kids, a lot of really talented young kids. But Gary was the only, you know, Nathan Bock was there, Jared Brennan was there, Jared Harbrough, Campbell Brown. I'm just thinking of the blokes that were there. But Gary was, you know, you think about that today. It is like Tasmania getting Nick Dacos. That, to me, is what it's like. Or maybe a young Marcus Bontempelli.
You know, that type of player. You're getting the best player in the competition to go and start as the inaugural captain of a start-up franchise. I mean, what a decision. I mean, I get it. Everyone would talk about that financially it was a great decision for him. But, yes, he still had to make a really, really brave decision to go away from everything he knew. everything.
And that was the Geelong football club and to challenge himself. And I thought he said that last night, you know, it was great for him to make that journey and to do something different in his life.
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Chapter 5: What are the current challenges with umpiring decisions?
On the premise that you want to get it right, you'll, I mean, and I think the lasso's worked okay. If there is a little bit of doubt, the umpires now just sort of call the boundary in and say, and again, they've got like 10 seconds to fix it. If you've, because it takes 15 seconds to throw the ball in by the time everything gets set up, the lasso gets you back in in five.
But if there's a little bit of doubt, you'll see that the field umpire will just call the boundary umpire and then by that stage, it's in the year now, it's come off, it's come off Waitley, it hasn't come off Swan and then they'll pay the lasso or they'll just say, no, throw it in there. You've got the right call. So that, I think that's working okay.
But again, it's all about the timing because, you know, you don't, part of the, the irony is what we've tried to do is make the game faster and more high scoring. And so if you're stopping, all the time for reviews and whatever, then, again, people get a bit antsy, and probably rightly so.
Chapter 6: How does the AFL review and analyze umpiring trends?
Greg Swann in the studio. We'll take our time here. We'll go deeper into the umpiring shortly. For City Power, Melbourne's weather, showers, wind easing, a top of 19. City Power, working in all conditions to keep your power connected, essential as. Greg Swarner is in the studio. You're talking to the hotbed of talkback radio here that does obsess over umpiring. Yeah.
So it's right in the mix every Monday. When you sit and watch the game, television or at home, how confident are you that you understand what's been awarded out on the field and can see an incident and go, this is this?
Chapter 7: What are the key issues with holding the ball rules?
Yeah. What would I say? Pretty confident. Very confident.
Yeah.
That's not to say they don't make a blue every now and again. That's what happens. I mean, players make blues. Coaches make blues. So that is going to happen.
Chapter 8: How is Collingwood's strategy impacting their performance?
But the rules themselves ā we talk every Monday. So the umpiring department and myself and some of my team, we sit every Monday. You talked about trends. We look at decisions because you watch games and you go, gee, how did they not pay that push in the back or how did they not ā How did they miss that high tackle? So we go through all those things.
I mean, it's much more rigorous than people think. And I know there's a criticism of the umpires review themselves, but it's reviewed highly. I mean, we've dropped umpires. Umpires have been missed games, but we don't make a song and dance about it. But, you know, look, they've had a bad week or bad two. They're going to go back and coach an umpire in the VFL. So, yeah.
The contentious ones always are holding the ball. We're looking at that. We're looking at a bit of work on it. And I know Ray's been on your show. And ironically, I had a couple of mates of mine who say, well, now that Ray's explained it, we actually get it more than we used to. It's still difficult that prior, no prior.
And then even the discussion about if you tackle and hold an arm, that's holding the ball effectively. But if you tackle and you've got both arms, then that's a ball up. So they're the grays that you sort of look and go, how do we clarify that?
I mean, the interesting part is, and it's great about the passion of the game, but when I go now, because I don't have a dog in the fight, I watch for mainly the umpiring and some of the, everyone's going nuts about stuff and you sort of think, that was a free. What do you want about you guys? You know, but that's the passion of American for your footy team. Um,
So in the main, I think, you know, they're running pretty highly, I think, as getting decisions right. It's about the thing that frustrates the fans is that, you know, the holding on ball. And it's a great tradition of our game. Nearly every tackle, they yell out ball.
But, you know, if you haven't got prior... And the other thing we are trying to do, which I think has been better, is they're blowing the whistle quicker so that when someone's tackled, they'll just blow the whistle and say...
let's ball it up um you know and just trying to get those things in so that you know we don't we we avoid the situation where somebody grabs the footy you know fights for 10 seconds and either gets it out or drops it or whatever so but we are having to look at some of the things that are that are difficult to umpire.
The one that I think, and this is personal, so I'm looking at this and half pushing at this. The handball's difficult with prior, but for me, the kicking isn't. So if you... And by what I mean to that is if you get tackled and you try and kick the footy and you don't kick it, as in you have a swing at it and miss, at the moment that's ā he tried playing on.
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