Grush

…You see people like Dave Grush come forward and get slimed. You know that there are other whistleblowers who have come forward bits and pieces. You have to realize at some point there's a lot of risk in taking action.…

…Yeah, I mean, I went forward in such close proximity to Grush that I didn't have... At that time, I hadn't observed the blowback. It looked like from the outside that he had some... friction on his way there, but looked like he got to Congress, was saying the right things, and Congress was going to do something about it.…

…Yeah. So as time passed, it became disturbing. Um, especially, uh, after the sort of, um, The process of Grush coming forward left a wake on the inside too. People were tracking that who weren't even involved, but were able to see sort of the distortions on the inside. Distortions of truth. Exactly. And, but also, you know, bureaucracies and offices behavin…