Adam Tooze

It's conceivable a time might come where those differences get erased, but we are not there

There's everything to play for, and presumably all of us engaged in this conversation think that's why we need to talk.

We need to talk publicly.

We need to make people laugh.

We need to make people think.

We need to engage with these questions because this is so not done.

I mean, we went back and forth on this a minute ago.

It's worth saying there's one really depressing thing going on, which is that people are leaving before Trump gets here.

which is another way of responding to this border, which is to say, no, I don't have to sit on the edge of this.

I don't want to be part of the spectacle.

I don't want to be dragged into this.

I don't have to be here.

And that is a kind of withdrawal.

It's very ambiguous, right?

Because it doesn't necessarily dispose.

The Europeans are going to meet on Thursday.

There's everything to play for.

But one of the things that's happening is that kind of stepping away.

And people are making choices literally today because we know what kind of security is going to happen and it's going to be mad.

And there's one faction which is leaving and there's another faction which is basically going to get locked into the conference center tomorrow.