Bella Freud

And I wondered how you nurture that balance of those things in your work.

Yeah, it's really hard.

I did some lessons once in LA and

It's an amazing feat to be able to do it.

I had no idea how hard and how expert it is to hold onto that pole and leave your hands free.

And the way you do it, it looks like real freedom.

It's incredibly beautiful.

Because you were talking about Wushu as well and the Chinese martial arts and that you've also included in some of your work.

And I remember I used to go to the cinema on Sunday nights sometimes in Leicester Square at midnight.

This was back in the end of the 70s with my best friend and we'd watch, they would show martial arts films all night long, no subtitles.

And most of the audience were the Chinese community.

And it was amazing, the atmosphere was so, everyone was talking and laughing and eating.

And these films were absolutely incredible.

And I read that you're working on a screenplay about the relationship between martial arts and the black community.

Yeah.

I suppose it's like you were saying about practice.

Yeah.

And it's so nuanced.

It's totally mysterious.

It's brilliant though.