Ben Fisher

So it's actually, it's not a business book, but it is.

It's called Thinking and Systems, a Primer by Danella Meadows.

And it's about symbolic systems, which is sort of the top level of it.

It's really about understanding the cause and effect between, you know,

seemingly unrelated things.

So within an organization, it might be the effect that, you know,

the amount of time people are spending in the office and the effect on productivity and how that ultimately affects some other element of the system.

It's basically the idea of looking at everything, every organization, everything as a system and understanding what the different levers are and what influences what.

Because oftentimes with any company, there's the thing that will have a disproportionate impact if you touch it or if you mess with it.

And so early on,

Same is true with marketing.

Early on, it's about identifying what's that one, what are those levers and what are the effects?

Very cool.

So, yes, I'm actually in Los Angeles right now.

I live in New York, but every year a few friends of mine who also run companies, we basically go, we rent a house in L.A.

for a month to hide from the snow.

And so I've been spent, we spend a lot of time talking about our own challenges.

It's basically a month long mastermind.

And so I've been learning a lot from a good friend of mine who runs TodayTix.

His name is Brian Fenty.