Cian Tracey

And supporters and listeners to this podcast are probably crying out for it.

I think you hit the nail on the head there.

It's evolution rather than revolution.

Well, you go back to the Mack Hansen example.

I know he had a lot more experience in Super Rugby, but Andy Farrell hasn't been afraid to kind of pick players if he believes they're ready.

So I think we would have to say that Andy Farrell has been a really good judge of talent and he clearly sees something in his game.

Like JJ Kenny is not...

He's not a guy who's been blazing a trail through the Ireland under-20s through your conventional pathway.

Came through in Bray and I think himself would admit that he's been a late bloomer.

So I think if you had offered JJ Kenny last summer, he was only in on Leinster on a trial basis initially.

If you had told him that he's going to be in an Ireland 15 squad come January, February, I think he would have snapped your hand off for it.

I think it's more someone like Zach Ward, Joe, who, like I said, is 27 years old.

I think a lot of people think himself and Tommy O'Brien are these whippersnappers who are just on the scene.

They've actually been around a lot longer than people think.

And if you're picking on form, then...

then Zach Ward has been more informed than James Lowe.

He's been more informed than Robert Ballacoon.

But Farrell must see some sort of chink in his game there.

But I think it's a surprise that he's not getting him in to smooth out those edges that he sees.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally.