Clare Stephens

Yeah, for sure.

It really does.

Yeah, yeah.

And I, as somebody who have followed her and adored girls and seen the trajectory of her career,

I think that there is enormous value in her writing that memoir and her coming out now and speaking about those experiences.

And I think it would be a huge shame if women like her were publicly shamed to the extent that they retreated from public life and never came back.

Do you know what I mean?

Because then public life, the public arena would only be occupied by a certain type of woman who is not Lena Dunham and a certain...

set of experiences.

Yeah, and for anyone listening who deals with chronic illness or chronic pain, there's a very interesting theory that the interviewer puts forward in that New York Times interview that she's basically able to withstand such negative things

negative feedback, such like social torture because of what she's been going through physically her whole life.

And I think that's a really interesting theory for anybody who has lived with chronic illness.

That was good.

Yeah.

Bye.

Moa Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of the land on which we have recorded this podcast.

I agree.

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