Dan Farah

And essentially, these programs are just moving along and keeping it to themselves.

And when you keep something to yourself, it's easy to...

slip a win into your commercialized side of your business.

That would be really interesting.

And who knows, by the way, if it's even public.

It might be something that they made that isn't public, that they're using to get bigger contracts in exchange for shutting up about it.

Yeah, I've heard a lot about that.

The tinfoil hat thing is a good reminder.

One of the things I learned is that the stigma around this was created by the people covering this up.

So in the early 50s, late 40s, the CIA, when they took control of this, they were like, we gotta make sure people don't ask about this.

How do we do that?

It's just a psychological operation.

Make people think they're crazy.

Make people think they're wacko.

Make tinfoil hat chokes.

And then that gets built into our culture and different generations grow up thinking

Oh, you're a nut if you talk about this.

It would be embarrassing.

You're going to have your career ruined.

And now here we are where, like, you know, people giggle when you bring up this serious issue, right?