David Hoffman

But like, I wonder if you were thinking about this kind of allegory or this kind of lesson when you were writing some of your work.

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Yeah, what I'm hearing from you is that, you know, all of the games that society plays, like using the expansive version of games,

are like, you know, we learned how to gamify some things or measure certain things.

And there's just like a series of games across society that people tend to participate in.

One, for example, if we're talking about health and fitness is like, you know, we've really...

codified down a nutritional label into protein, carbs, fats, and sodium, and a few other things.

And we say, make sure you get your points here in the correct way.

And the American Heart Association gives these points a thumbs up.

And then what we lose track of is some of the more nebulous, loose ideas of health, which is eating food that was grown more domestically closer to you from farmer's markets is actually also extremely healthy.