Dr. Chloe Carmichael

I sat with men who told me that they were being victimized by women who did this.

And I sat with women who a decade earlier had made up a rape charge to get out of a unfortunate sex experience accountability.

And it was just easier.

And then years later, they feel terrible with guilt.

Like it doesn't fully sink in for them what they did until many years later.

So I think it's a fascinating conversation.

Yeah, totally.

But again, it's that weird celebration paradox where if you want to talk about women and sexuality or women in work or women in anything, we can talk about toxic masculinity all day long.

But toxic femininity traits, which is interesting, it's called Marianismo.

Yeah.

super fascinating.

Like there's machismo, which everybody talks about, but nobody talks about marionismo, which is like where you can weaponize your sense of victimhood in order to become manipulative with it.

And I think you're right.

I think for us to have a whole accountable conversation, we have to be able to talk about that.

Otherwise we get people like NF, who's the only one who's going to just say it, right?

So we have to be able to bring these conversations.

Yeah.

It's become reactionary.

yeah totally and that what we're talking about there the black and white you know kind of shift about you know the victim and the oppressor you know we we see that happening with sex obviously but i think we also see it happening with race i mean did you guys hear about what happened in portland right that this man was acquitted of a stabbing because the victim used the n-word and

after he was stabbed.