Hamish Macdonald

What are the numbers?

What precisely are you saying?

What's the policy that's being offered that you think is going to fix the problem that is being discussed here?

If the argument is that immigration means you can't afford a home, what's the link?

What's the evidence?

I guess that's where, in this picture, I think facts become even more important.

But I don't think that's necessary.

I mean, I haven't watched that interview, but I don't know how much questioning there was of actual policy.

But I can't keep up to date with the realities of every single thing and every single... Well, we've all been in those situations, right, where you're having a conversation, you know, or an argument with someone and it's like no one at this table has all of the facts here.

No one really knows enough about this.

Totally, totally.

But, you know, like...

I went to Finland about 18 months ago for work.

It's not part of this series, but one of the things that really fascinated me there is that they teach information and media literacy to kids from school age up, from primary school up.

And, you know, in part this is because they're right next door to Russia.

They've had Russian mis- and disinformation coming at them for many decades.

And they've seen the need to build a kind of a population that is ready and armed to deal with this themselves.

And so they teach kids things like triangulation of stories.

So if you see something on social media, Ryan, that gives you a reaction, not just, and I know you're saying you don't feel like the New York Times articles are too long for you.

But if you see a thing on social media that you then go and look for a couple of other versions of that story to read the different takes on it so that you at least end up with something that is, you have some perception of the kind of spectrum of views that there are on this so that you at least can kind of build your own picture of it.