Jo Setchell

It's everywhere in the natural world.

Absolutely.

Oh, well, I would never get away with calling it a loving relationship in a scientific article, I don't think.

Maybe people will in future.

But when you write the popular book, that's different.

Which feels weird and against... This is very culture-bound, historically time-bound phenomenon.

There are instances of cultures around the world where men wear make-up and perform for the women to choose.

I would be a dominant female mandrill for two reasons.

One is I think they have the best life.

They're totally in charge.

They know they're going to be in charge for the whole of their lives.

And no-one gives them any trouble.

That's the first reason.

And the other reason is then I'd know what it was like to be a female mandrill.

Yeah.

You can be the next one down in the hierarchy.