Leslie Kean

And when I was there, John Mack's father was in the English department. Now, I knew his name. I didn't know him. I didn't have a course with him. I certainly didn't ask him about his son, who was at that point not yet investigating UFOs, studying psychiatry. But anyway... So Mac came from this fairly prominent family.

Interestingly enough, his mother died when he was eight months old of appendicitis. She was pretty prominent herself, came from the Rheingold family of beer brewers.

Interestingly enough, his mother died when he was eight months old of appendicitis. She was pretty prominent herself, came from the Rheingold family of beer brewers.

Interestingly enough, his mother died when he was eight months old of appendicitis. She was pretty prominent herself, came from the Rheingold family of beer brewers.

and so he came from a kind of a wealthy background and he was a real leader in psychiatry he was a very he was a social activist he believed in trying to make the world better he thought he could bring peace to the Middle East he met with Yasser Arafat he lectured in the Middle East and he marched against nuclear weapons he was arrested in your neck of the woods up there and

and so he came from a kind of a wealthy background and he was a real leader in psychiatry he was a very he was a social activist he believed in trying to make the world better he thought he could bring peace to the Middle East he met with Yasser Arafat he lectured in the Middle East and he marched against nuclear weapons he was arrested in your neck of the woods up there and

and so he came from a kind of a wealthy background and he was a real leader in psychiatry he was a very he was a social activist he believed in trying to make the world better he thought he could bring peace to the Middle East he met with Yasser Arafat he lectured in the Middle East and he marched against nuclear weapons he was arrested in your neck of the woods up there and

at some of the test sites, the atomic test sites. So he was very active, politically active, and As, again, often happens, he got interested in these strange healing methods where you relax or you go into hypnosis and your body can project itself, astral projection. And that was his introduction to the world, the paranormal world. He didn't believe in it at first at all. But...

at some of the test sites, the atomic test sites. So he was very active, politically active, and As, again, often happens, he got interested in these strange healing methods where you relax or you go into hypnosis and your body can project itself, astral projection. And that was his introduction to the world, the paranormal world. He didn't believe in it at first at all. But...

at some of the test sites, the atomic test sites. So he was very active, politically active, and As, again, often happens, he got interested in these strange healing methods where you relax or you go into hypnosis and your body can project itself, astral projection. And that was his introduction to the world, the paranormal world. He didn't believe in it at first at all. But...

he met the Stan Groff who was experimenting with all these hypnosis style technique of projecting your body and relaxing and at one of these sessions in California where else he ran into this woman who was telling him I have a friend Bud Hopkins and he's interviewing all these people who were abducted by aliens and Mac thought it was a lot of nonsense and

he met the Stan Groff who was experimenting with all these hypnosis style technique of projecting your body and relaxing and at one of these sessions in California where else he ran into this woman who was telling him I have a friend Bud Hopkins and he's interviewing all these people who were abducted by aliens and Mac thought it was a lot of nonsense and

he met the Stan Groff who was experimenting with all these hypnosis style technique of projecting your body and relaxing and at one of these sessions in California where else he ran into this woman who was telling him I have a friend Bud Hopkins and he's interviewing all these people who were abducted by aliens and Mac thought it was a lot of nonsense and

But, again, one of the strange things that happened in life, he was in New York, and he decided to call up Bud Hopkins pretty much out of the blue after dismissing it. And Hopkins showed him – Bud had written these books about – uh, encounters, uh, very strange encounters that he, he, he was an artist. He, he was not a psychiatrist like Mac. He was an artist.

But, again, one of the strange things that happened in life, he was in New York, and he decided to call up Bud Hopkins pretty much out of the blue after dismissing it. And Hopkins showed him – Bud had written these books about – uh, encounters, uh, very strange encounters that he, he, he was an artist. He, he was not a psychiatrist like Mac. He was an artist.

But, again, one of the strange things that happened in life, he was in New York, and he decided to call up Bud Hopkins pretty much out of the blue after dismissing it. And Hopkins showed him – Bud had written these books about – uh, encounters, uh, very strange encounters that he, he, he was an artist. He, he was not a psychiatrist like Mac. He was an artist.

Uh, but he got interested in the subject because he had spotted a UFO in Cape Cod. So he started meeting these people and hypnotized, studied hypnosis, you know, put them in a relaxed state and heard their stories. And then he meets John Mac and he said, gee, John, you're the psychiatrist. You know, what do you make of this?

Uh, but he got interested in the subject because he had spotted a UFO in Cape Cod. So he started meeting these people and hypnotized, studied hypnosis, you know, put them in a relaxed state and heard their stories. And then he meets John Mac and he said, gee, John, you're the psychiatrist. You know, what do you make of this?

Uh, but he got interested in the subject because he had spotted a UFO in Cape Cod. So he started meeting these people and hypnotized, studied hypnosis, you know, put them in a relaxed state and heard their stories. And then he meets John Mac and he said, gee, John, you're the psychiatrist. You know, what do you make of this?

So he gave John a bunch of letters from these people who were responding to Bud's books about, you know, abductions. And John was totally intrigued. And he had the courage, as I said, to pursue it. You know, he could have said, look, this is going to kill me at Harvard. I mean, but he got interested. He collected his own group of people with these stories.