Matt Jones

And you have a mortgage and you have to do you know what I mean?

No, that's true.

I know Scott Jennings, and I know he's not like he is.

He got started, his first time on television was with me.

I know he's not like he is, but the more he's like he is, the more popular he gets.

So it's almost like the incentive structure requires him to be like that.

Social media and the internet make that worse.

Let's end with this on culture.

When I was young and in college, et cetera, I remember the final episode of Seinfeld, the final episode of season one of Survivor.

All music artists, everybody at least knew who they were, even if it wasn't the kind of music you were interested in.

In today's world, is there any unifying culture at all to you?

Is Taylor Swift and like the Superbowl, the last of the things that people all at least know something about Taylor Swift?

That was one.

Yes, Tiger King.

But TV is interesting because I love television and I find it fascinating.

The kind of television I like tends to be talked about a lot.

But then there's this whole world of television that I don't even know exists that gets massive ratings like the CBS Friday night shows like Blue Bloods and all this.

My mom watches every episode.

It's been on for 20 years and I don't think the popular culture has ever talked about it.

Like, it's never in the New York Times, but heated rivalry, a gay hockey show that maybe two million people have watched, gets every headline, and the guys are coming out at the Golden Globes.