Michael Pollan

And some take that as evidence of consciousness.

Yeah.

So...

You're bringing up the issue that immediately comes to mind when you start hearing about plant consciousness, which is, are we hurting them?

When we mow the lawn, is that beautiful scent of freshly mown grass the scream of suffering?

And that'll make you crazy.

Yeah, although there's all this worry about this in Silicon Valley, you know, that our tender hearts should go out to these machines that might be conscious and we owe moral consideration to the machines.

Yeah.

And also they love the conversation about the far future or near far future of, you know, whether it's boomer or doomer view, because it's a great way not to deal with what's right in front of us.

Dogs and rabbits, yeah.

Yeah, and the power of an idea.

I mean, he developed this idea that humans have this monopoly on consciousness.

I think, therefore, I am.

In other words, the thing I know is that I'm a conscious being and nobody else has it.

No other creature has it.

He was so convinced of his own idea that when these animals screamed sounds that we would have no trouble interpreting as suffering, he didn't hear it as suffering.

He just thought it was automatic noise.

And it is hard to believe.

And it's true.

I mean, it tells you something about the power of an idea to overcome our feelings, our instincts.