Neal Lawson

speaker

349 appearances 1 recordings 1 series first heard Jul 2026 last heard 24 Jul

Neal Lawson’s voice in public audio — every appearance, attributed to the second.

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Recordings per month over the last 12 months — 1 in all, peaking in Jul 2026 with 1.

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And we're going to have to work our way through the answer to that.

But starting with the question is a good point.

There is a theory in cybernetics that says that to govern any entity, you need a governance system which is equally as complex as it, right?

So that's why, for instance, I think cross-party stuff is good because you bring more voices in.

It isn't just a narrow band of people.

So you want pluralism in the Labour Party to get to address the complexity.

You need alliances across progressive parties to address the complexity.

You need to go down to, you know, devolve down to other people and other places to address the complexity.

You need to bring in, as I've said, kind of citizens' assemblies.

You need to bring all the voices in in order to address that stuff.

What you end up with then, I'm not sure if it's a kind of, you know...

Burnhamism that's a moment in history like Thatcherism was or Attleeism was or whatever.

I don't know what that looks like in terms of being a solid, identifiable, monolithic settlement era.

But it could be a more complex, nuanced,

creative, enterprising way of addressing all of this policy, you know, poly-crisis stuff that's around us.

And that's what I want from a leader, someone who wants to explore that stuff with other people and test out that stuff.

You think that's the stakes?

Well, I think he said that this is the last chance.

I went out knocking on doors in Makerfield, you know, and they were voting there for Andy, not for the Labour Party.

It was the last chance saloon.

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