Oli Gardner

I've been in conferences walking around, speaking to someone from a company, and they're like, oh, you guys are really cool, but you're too cheap, so we wouldn't use you.

You can go on like a demo account, which, you know, there's no credit card needed.

You can just go in there.

It's limited in what you can do, but you can get in there.

You can publish a page live.

You can do everything.

you know, pretty much everything you want, but then, you know, you want to get it on your own domain.

So it's just not a temporary one then.

So you have to pay to get to that step, but you can get in and evaluate the product.

Good work.

Yeah, some of those, I'm not the best person for that.

That's okay.

In terms of churn, we've had a problem with that, like most SaaS businesses do, but primarily because some people upgrade and downgrade.

We make it very easy to downgrade.

We don't want you to have problems with that.

So people that are called flappers, they come up and down because they're not always running campaigns.

I mean, we know that you need landing pages for everything you do, so we would never turn off our sales, but not everybody has come to the...

figured out that benefit in all these different ways.

So sometimes they downgrade then come back.

That's the reason we launched this convertibles set of tools because then we're on the website too and you're getting tons of leads and being very successful there so you're less likely to want to turn it off.