Richard Dolan

And I'm glad Gary Nolan is part of that.

Gary Nolan, I think is a,

is a good presence on this.

His opinion is he doesn't really care what political leaders have to say about disclosure.

The only thing I care about is can it be discussed in a peer-reviewed scientific journal, like this reality.

And I think that's actually a very intelligent position for a scientist to take.

So I think that's a good thing to have him on there.

What do you think about Schirmer's inclusion?

No one who has any knowledge has trust in Arrow.

No one.

Go on, go on.

Well, I agree with you basically in your attitude on this.

I mean, the thing is, anytime you get an established academician involved in this, and that includes Avi Loeb, he's Harvard.

You really do have to wonder because the academic world has really not produced much of value on this subject.

I mean, really, it's, you consider the amount of,

of intellectual power that would exist in the academic world and how meaningless and paltry the actual level of thinking has been coming from that world.

It's really quite remarkable.

So you're dealing with a very powerful part of the establishment.

I mean, that's really what we're talking about here.

This is US government establishment directive.