Rob Walling

And the reason I'm saying we start there is we post on the job boards, we promote it through our socials and our owned media.

We put it through our email lists and we go to the tiny seed Slack.

But then we start working on our network and asking folks, you know, do you know folks who might fit this description?

And the owner-level thinkers that I work with now have come through a mix.

Some of them were known previously by me and folks on my team.

So Tracy Osborne, who's the head of product and does a lot of the heavy lifting at MicroConf and TinySeed, spoke at MicroConf in 2016, I believe.

And she was a startup founder of Wedding Lovely and had gone through 500 startups.

And we hadn't stayed in touch, but when we posted this job description in February,

I think it was, what, 2019?

Yeah, 2019, 2020.

She was interested.

And I was like, oh, a former startup founder interested in doing this role?

That's instantly a good sign.

Now, it can be a bad sign.

You know, take it on the flip side.

Some folks' startups fail because they kind of drive it into the ground and they're not good at it.

And then some folks' startups fail because most startups fail.

You know, and that's just the way it goes.

But it's not as if there's some secret place to find these folks.

I mean, for us, it's literally just job boards.