Rob Walling

And the key is screening, right?

It's getting down to the folks who are really executing and who have a role that is similar or have the raw material, and this is where it gets tough, is you're investing in someone to become that.

Because when Tracy started working with us back in 2019...

She was a really solid and exceptional project level thinker.

I think that's my evaluation these days.

It's funny, I haven't really thought about this.

But she's developed into an owner level thinker over the years.

And there's a couple other folks on our team that have done that.

And so I think there's a certain amount of seeing the potential in people.

But that can be dangerous, right?

Because you can see potential that they never develop into.

And of course being able to actually evaluate project and owner level thinkers is something we're going to talk about in a second.

But this second question of how long did it take you to find them

a normal amount, whatever it is, a couple months from posting the job until they were hired and starting, two months, two and a half months, whatever, until they gave notice and all that.

So it was a normal amount, but then the question is how long to integrate them in the company.

And that's the big thing, right, is I think a lot of folks become owner-level thinkers

when given the ability to stretch their wings and when given the responsibility, and they have to earn it, but a lot of folks have worked at other companies and they've potentially been constrained by management or lack of responsibility or there's just not room for them, there's no growth opportunity there.

And so I guess what I'm saying is a lot of folks you hire like this I think are going to be more project level, but it's the question you're asking yourself as you talk to them is, do I think they have the ability

to become, to grow into this role as an owner level thinker.

And the interesting thing is I have no guess on timeline.