Tristan Harris

Here we are, the labs are saying there's 18 months to recursive self-improvement.

If you could imagine the perfect timeline for how humanity would proceed from where we are to land in a safe place over the next 18 months, could you just say a few lines about what would happen in the midterms?

What would happen next in the US-China relationship?

We would pass the Chip Security Act.

We would make sure that location attestation was on NVIDIA chips.

We'd have a...

academics, you know, accelerate research in all computer science departments across the country.

We would have AI labs and employees, you know, lobby their employers saying, we're not going to continue working for you until you use your power as an AI lab to actually, you know, advocate for these solutions.

Like, give us a taste of what would happen in that story if things were to go well.

One other sort of thing I'd add to your list of interventions that I'd love to see is imagine at the UNGA conference coming up, where all the world leaders are gathering in September, you had basically an obligate tabletop exercise where all the world leaders walk through what happens as countries escalate towards these crazier and crazier AI capabilities.

It takes about two and a half to three hours.

Daniel Coccatello, a former podcast guest, runs these.

And people, policymakers, come to various conclusions that

some kind of agreement or coordination with other actors in the world will need to happen to end up in a safer outcome.

This has been really inspiring.

There's so many examples of how we can verify things that I think most people, if they just use their own basic intuition, they'd say, this is impossible.

There's no way we could do it.

It looks that way to everybody building nuclear weapons.

And had we given up, we would have ended up in a different world or may not even be here today.

And I think what you both are working on is so critical and so important.