Chapter 1: What is discussed at the start of this section?
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts, or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert, Experts on Expert. I'm Dan Buck-Roger Shepard, and I'm joined by Lily Padman, Donkey Mule. Padman.
Oh, wow.
People are going to be thrilled about today's guest.
They sure are.
She's so popular and for good reason.
That's right.
Mel Robbins. Mel Robbins is a creator, an entrepreneur, a best-selling author, and podcast host. Her books include The Let Them Theory, biggest book of the year. Huge book. All genres.
Wow. Over 6 million copies sold. Whoa-ee.
Yeah, it's like Sapiens.
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Chapter 2: Who is Mel Robbins and what are her accomplishments?
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Are you by Killington by chance?
We are about 45 minutes. I live in Vermont.
Being Michiganders, if we wanted to go to a real ski hill.
Boynton Mountain, baby.
Boynton Mountain, Shanty Creek. That's your area. Muskegon? Yeah, Muskegon. But if you wanted a real 6,000 feet of vertical. In Michigan? Exactly. There isn't any in Michigan. The closest is Killington.
The closest 6,000-foot peak is Killington?
Yeah.
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Chapter 3: What challenges did Mel face during her college years?
That was credit cards. That was factoring against the receipts.
Home equity at a house that's no longer worth what it was. Correct.
And friends and family had invested. Yeah.
Yeah.
And it wasn't like they were trying to fail. You got one open. Things were going sideways. You got friends and family involved. You're in a small community. Three kids under the age of 10. Leans on the house. Bills piled sky high. I've lost my job. And in these moments... It's so much easier to be angry at your husband. I would lay in bed in the morning and be like, I hate my life.
I hate my husband. What the hell? I didn't have anything to do with it. That is the beginning.
How severe is the drinking? Just because I'm an addict. I want to know what's happening during this time.
I would say probably four to five Manhattans a night.
Okay, great. You're getting bombed every night. Every night.
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Chapter 4: What does the Let Them Theory teach about personal control?
It's not about managing and changing other people. If you don't like what you see in the world or in your relationships, stop trying to change everybody else.
Yeah, there's two variables. You only have control over one of the variables, you. Yes, and it's you. So I like how you say, though, it's like, if I want to be on that trip, I need to get my business life under control so that I think I have the freedom. I need to reach out more. I need to get myself there if that's what I want.
Because what happens when you say the let me part is you are forced to question, what are my values? So let's take the example of family, because my favorite thing about the let them theory is it doesn't actually cut off relationships.
Chapter 5: How can acceptance improve relationships?
It forces you to operate with acceptance, which creates a space for actual connection. We've been so busy trying to change and control one another, especially in families and marriages and friendships, that we're not actually loving each other. And what I have learned in using Let Them and Let Me is that I deeply value family. I deeply value my 29 year marriage with Chris.
I deeply value my connection with my kids and my friends. If I value it, then it's on me. And I had to come to terms with the fact that I was a very tit for tat person. Like we all have friends that keep score. I did this. I've invited you three times.
Chapter 6: What are the implications of letting go of expectations?
You're not inviting me. I keep calling my brother. He never calls me. Well, let him. And now let me ask myself, does family matter to me?
What are my values regardless of what theirs are? It doesn't matter.
And then that way, you're reaching out not out of obligation. You're reaching out not in order to keep score. You're reaching out not because you think you should. You're reaching out because you want to. Because it makes you feel like a good sister. It makes you feel like a good mother. Who do you want to be in this world? Yes. And the same thing's true about the world around us.
Like the stuff that's going on in the headlines, it's already happening. And so let them isn't just allow it. Let them is radical acceptance because it forces you to recognize the truth of what's happening. And then you say, let me ask myself, what do I value?
Chapter 7: How does one navigate difficult relationships using the Let Them Theory?
And where do I want to put my time and energy in terms of trying to change things for the better?
Yeah, it marries so concisely two of my favorite tenets of AA. One is acceptance is the answer to all of our problems, right? And that, fuck, it's painfully true. I think people's hurdle and barrier with Let Them is acceptance. they associate it with surrender. If I say, let them be rude or let them, you know, whatever thing you've decided, that somehow that's a surrender. But I would argue that,
You need to walk that further down the path. So if you don't do that and you continue to resent and have poison in your belly about this person, that's victory. You actually have to question what is victory. If surrenders defeat, what is victory? You being agitated all the time and consumed with what everyone else should be doing. That can't be victory.
So let's just start by like, we got to define what victory is. Victory for me is peace and serenity. So it's not a surrender to me to get to peace and serenity. It's actually the opposite.
It's the opposite. I want to unpack real quick because I think this is one of the most important things and ways you can use it. And that is, how do you use this with people that are very challenging or very disrespectful? Because the fact is, it's easy on Instagram to write about cutting people off. But most of us have somebody in our families... that are very challenging.
Probably multiple people.
Yes. And we don't want to cut them off. We just wish that we could get along. We wish there wasn't so much tension. And one of the most beautiful things about the let them theory is that it forces you, perhaps for the first time, to see people as they are and as they're not. If you have somebody in your family who has a narcissistic personality style, they've been like this forever.
You don't need to brace going into family interactions because you're going to let them.
You already know it. You already know it.
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