Do we underestimate the struggle of a working mother?
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What sparked the conversation about the struggles of working mothers?
The Clare Byrne Show on Newstalk. With Aviva Insurance.
Is it possible to parent the way that you want and be as present for your children as you'd like while holding down a full time job? And is the pressure to do both becoming too much? Well, I'm joined now by audience editor at The Irish Times, Fiona Ellis, who has written about this and whose recent article sparked huge conversation and reaction. Fiona, you're very welcome to the programme. You've had an extraordinary response to this piece that was published last week.
Yes. In fact, it was very surprising. We got letters, we got messages, we got letters to the editor. I got calls, I got stopped at the school gates. Like it really resonated with people
and
it was surprising in a way. And I... I have been saying to people I've been talking to about it a little bit sad because when you think about like the language I use, like I didn't hold back in the article. You
called it a horror show.
I called it a horror show. I mean, I'm actually really happy. But I said stuff like leaving my child in Crest was devastating, that I was unhinged, I was a woman on the edge. And then all women across Ireland were like, Yeah, same. Us too. And in a way, it's a little bit sad when you think about it.
I did feel a visceral, it was like a physical reaction when you describe looking at the camera in the creche and watching your little girls, the back of her head toddling around and watch somebody else reading her story. It's really tough.
I mean, it was tough to sit there and watch. Like if I went back now, I would prefer not to have been able to look at her. But I would I would sit in my office and I had two screens and one screen. I put the CCTV camera of her and the other screen.
How did Fiona’s article describe the ‘horror show’ of leaving a child in creche?
I would do my work and I would be looking at every second of the day looking at her. And if my mom picked her up early, I'd be watching my mom come get her. And then I'd be like, oh, thank
God. You feel relieved then, you can switch it off.
Yeah.
And you chose that creche because of the cameras that you wanted to be able to see.
No, I didn't. It just was a perk for that creche. In fact, I found it really hard to get a creche in the first place, which I know is another issue for working mothers, especially now. And this was, I met a friend of mine on the street and she was going to visit the creche. And I hadn't, like I was due back of work in about two months. I had a creche and I was like, I'll come with you. I'll come with you to see this creche. And she got into that. And that was kind of their USP that you can watch your child throughout the day. And it was one of the few ones that had baby, you know, under one spaces
in the creche as
well.
Now your children are a little bit older. Yeah. Yeah. Is it easier, would you say, or just different?
I think it's way easier, I think. But also, it's still incredibly difficult. When we're talking about the response I got from people, I thought it was interesting that I heard from women who had babies and who were like in the trenches. And I heard from women who had older kids like me. And then I heard from women whose children were adults. And we're still going through it. Like we've all got the things to do that we're struggling with. We have the pressure to be like the perfect employee and then the perfect mum when you come home. And we're feeling it across like the whole years of mothering that you do.
What did listeners say about the pressure to be a perfect employee and mum?
I think it's much easier. Now, for me, that they're older and they can dress themselves and get some cereal before bed
if
I'm working. I found the baby time the hardest, but I think that was also like it's such a big change when you have a baby. Like it's incredible. And you're almost trying to get back to the same employee or the same worker that you were before you had a baby. But you are so much more stretched. So I think that's an issue as well with mothers. They're expecting too much of themselves and they should give themselves a break.
Do we all agree now that you can't have it all? You can't do it all?
No, you can't. Actually, you can do it all, but you're not going to be happy about it and you're going to be very, very stressed out about it.
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Chapters
8 chapters
1
What sparked the conversation about the struggles of working mothers?
0:01–1:42
2
How did Fiona’s article describe the ‘horror show’ of leaving a child in creche?
1:42–3:04
3
What did listeners say about the pressure to be a perfect employee and mum?
3:04–5:04
4
How has flexible working and COVID‑19 changed motherhood challenges?
5:04–7:25
5
Why do dads often miss the invisible labour that mothers carry out?
7:25–8:35
6
What solutions did the hosts suggest for sharing household and childcare tasks?
8:35–10:27
7
How can women gain real choice between full‑time work, part‑time or staying home?
10:27–12:21
8
Where can listeners find Fiona Ellis’s article and why is it worth reading?
12:21–13:28