Show notes
Making money from something that you love is everyone's dream in life. It can also be one of the most difficult things to do. It involves hard work and taking risks. Rob interviews in this episode, Dom Joly, author and creator of the candid camera series Trigger Happy TV. They talk through how he accidentally fell into the show, his work as an author and what has made him successful. Learn from the ‘poster-child of not knowing what to do in life’ on how to best capture those opportunities when they present themselves and build a life doing the things you love.
Key Takeaways
I have a very active mind. I’m always thinking about something. That mindset allows me to come up with ideas, but sometimes I can get swamped. In India, I went to an Ashram where I nearly died when I was trying to be alone and do nothing.
I’m a jack of all trades, master of none. I remember my dad saying that if you leave a job once you would never get a job again. I don’t know what I’m doing each year. You make that sacrifice of stability and a regular income. It would be quite nice to have something stable but I would get bored.
I don’t say no. I’ve had times where I have had no offers but since Trigger Happy I have been offered lots of different things. I was offered a column at the Indy which has been great. Sometimes the thing that you are not good at people will pay you for, but sometimes the things that you like doing don’t pay well. I try to do one to fund the other.
I think good art comes from hunger. I look at it like this that if I do an ad it will pay me so I can do the things that I like doing. I think that having too much money means that you lose that hunger, you get lazy. I think poverty is a really important thing for creating art.
I’m really good at the least respected part of comedy. Trigger Happy was basically a candid camera series. I tried to make the candid camera as an art form. It’s ad-libbing, its improv. The great films like Spinal Tap and Curb Your Enthusiasm are all improv. I did everything for the Trigger Happy TV, editing, the music etc. Everyone thinks they can do it but it’s difficult, hard work to make it really really good.
It was total luck that created Trigger Happy. I was doing some interviews as a political producer for ITN. I was boring so I would ask my friends to do silly things in the background of the interviews with people like Paddy Ashdown. At that point when ITN fired me, I thought that was a great idea. I wanted to get paid for having fun.
Half Luck, Half Not. People assume that I could go and do a best man speech however that is something I would hate. However, if I dress in a snail outfit and crawl across the road really slowly, I don’t mind that. Often a lot of the things now are faked. There were about 6 rooms in my life where if I hadn’t had been there at that time, things would have been very different. 10,000 things are important. If you’ve dedicated 10,000 hours to something you're going to be really good at it.
How can I have fun doing something I love and make a living out of it? The only truth I know is that I’m really good at the things that I love. I’m jealous of those people who know what they like early on but that’s not me.
How did you get into hidden camera for a living? I was really lucky. The year before I started Trigger Happy I would have had to hire a professional cameraman and sound man to follow me around. Suddenly cameras became cheaper which we then could film the whole of Trigger Happy on. We just filmed and filmed and filmed until we got something funny. Now, I would just make something on my iPhone and put it on YouTube.
How do make you good pranks? You can do that if you have a brain. There is a snobbery in comedy that you must to sit-coms and scripts and that the exhibitionists do candid camera. It’s an adrenaline rush when you set something up. This whole street is going on, but then we were going to do something that was going to change the whole thing. The real test is watching something with people who weren’t there. Self-editing was important. It’s all about quantity when you first start. Just focus on what you and the people you're making find funny. The worst thing that could happen is comedy via committee.
When people say that creatives are divas or difficult that’s essential to create something great. When you’re making something, make sure it’s your voice coming through not tarnished by anyone else, and not a cover of anyone else. You have to be a monster and have obsessive control over your product but be nice to the people who are helping you create it.
I’m much more upset when I've made things that I knew that I have just taken the foot off the pedal in working on. Sometimes you have to be a monster to make some great stuff. Sometimes you have to make stuff that some people hate, for lots of people to love it.
I only watch documentaries. Alexander McQueen was someone who knew what he wanted to do when he was young and worked hard for it. But it killed him in the end. I love music but I’m not a snob so I can listen to a Kylie Minogue song and a Nick Cave song.
All things that are great come from the feeling that you just have to do it, not just for money. It’s more difficult now because it’s hard to get the money to do it. When you have a family that’s difficult. It’s about having the courage to do something that is different. There is something self-destructive of being British and when you get famous that you try and become un-famous.
You’ve been prepared to fail. I didn’t know whether it was right or wrong I just knew I loved it. Suddenly, you make it and the feeling of trying to keep that going is difficult. If you go somewhere cold, there is always a lovely bar and always some kind of quality art. It makes you insular. If the outside is hostile then you start to think and write a lot.
I never think of myself as an entrepreneur. For me, it means being financially secure, and know what they are doing business-wise. However, for me, I don’t know what I’m going to earn from year to year. I wish I had married an accountant or had a twin brother who had really business focused mind.
What are you up to next? As I’m fifty there is a level of energy that is required for doing candid camera. I’ve loved riffing in the past but I have a sitcom script optioned at the minute. There is no other person I can go to and ask for advice. I would like to live another 35 years.
TV is dead. My teenage kids are not watching TV, they are on their screens. We still get royalties on Trigger which I own 6% of. I put my life and soul into that show, and I only get 6%. I don’t know who the 94% are who own it. Going back now I would have got a loan and do it myself.. I do that now with my own production company. My deal was a good one compared to others though.
My books have actually done very well, but the people who liked Trigger Happy don’t read the books. All I ever wanted to do was travel as a kid. Reading Tin-Tin, I wanted to go everywhere that he went. I like going to places that are different. My new book is Hezbollah Hiking Club. I walked from the Syrian border to the Lebanon border. The best thing I’ve ever done is the Dark Tourist. I went to North Korea, for a holiday and other places that are not your usual holiday destinations.
I think someone else decides whether something else is art. All I have control over is making sure I have fun doing something. I’d like some kid listening to this to think it’s ok to not know what to do in life. There is no mystery to be successful. Just do it.
Best advice you have ever received. My dad said that don’t be the person who is the interpreter be the person who is being interpreted.The worst advice I ever received is that you should be a team player. Don’t be horrible to the people around you. But the worst aspect of this is that you have to take advice about everything from others. Be true to your own voice.
What do you think is wrong in the world? I stand for anti-bullying. If you believe in something that why have to force everyone to do the same. Keep it to yourself.
What does disruptive mean to you? Mess things up. I’m quite conservative with a small ‘c’, but I don’t like bullies. Challenge the norm.
Best Moments
‘I love writing with distractions.’
‘Always need stuff going on.’
‘Always had the world service on in the background.’
‘I’m a jack of all trades, master of none’
‘Since I’m 30 I have never hated a day of work.’
‘I think good art comes from hunger.’
‘Trigger Happy launched a lot of other hidden camera shows.’
‘Candid camera is an art-form.’
‘I really wanted to have fun.’
‘I wanted to get paid for having fun.’
‘You get moments and then you have to pounce on it.’
‘I’m jealous of the people who know exactly what they want to do.’
‘You have to know when to make your own luck.’
‘Keep looking for those opportunities.’
‘I think you have to go for your gut.’
‘Its harder to take the risk when you have more responsibilities.’
‘You have to get your own filter, on what was good.’
‘More offended of making vanilla stuff.’
‘I either want to love or hate an album.’
‘Failure feeds art.’
‘When you have a family and kids, it’s not your choice anymore.’
‘You can always have your what-if’s, this is your life. I never said no.’
‘Everything in moderation, everything in extreme.’
‘TV is dead.’
‘I’m the poster child for not knowing what I want to do.’
‘I’m the realistic entrepreneur.’
[Business, mindset, entrepreneur, disruptors]
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ABOUT THE HOST
Rob Moore is an author of 9 business books, 5 UK bestsellers, holds 3 world records for public speaking, entrepreneur, property investor, and property educator. Author of the global bestseller “Life Leverage” Host of UK’s No.1 business podcast “Disruptors”
“If you don't risk anything, you risk everything”
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ABOUT THE GUEST
Dom Joly is a multi-award winning television comedian, journalist and travel writer. His first television series, Trigger Happy TV, was a prime-time Friday night hit for Channel 4 in 2000-2003 and went on to be sold in over fifty countries worldwide and win several awards including the Silver Rose of Montreux.
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