TPP 520: Dr. Özgür Bolat on Why Rewards Backfire and the Real Science of Motivating Kids
episode
Full-Tilt Parenting: Strategies, Insights, and Connection for Parents Raising Neurodivergent Children
39 min
1 speaker
5 chapters
transcribed 18 hours ago
Transcript
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What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
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I'm Debbie Reber, and this is Full Till Parenting. Today I am talking with Dr. Osgar Bolot about his new book, The Reward Trap, and why some of the tools we commonly use to motivate kids from praise and prizes to other external rewards can actually undermine the very motivation we're hoping to build. Osgar is an education scientist, a researcher, an associate professor, and an author whose work focuses on. Parenting and teaching. He holds a master's degree from Harvard Graduate School of Education and a PhD from the University of Cambridge, and he's a sought after speaker and parent educator. So, in this conversation, we do kind of a deep dive into rewards. We explore why rewards can lead to short term compliance while actually undermining intrinsic motivation.
We talk about how external validation can Really shape a child's self-esteem and confidence long term and what it looks like to shift from a control mindset to one rooted in connection, autonomy, effort, and trust. I really enjoyed having this conversation. We could have talked for hours. We kind of went down some interesting rabbit holes, but I find this concept of rewards and motivation, especially with our neurodivergent kids, so fast. Fascinating because we're often getting mixed messages from the different people who are trying to help us support our kids. So here's my conversation with Dr. Osgar Bolat. Hey Doctor Bola, welcome to the podcast.
Thank you so much, Davi. I'm very excited to share my ideas. Thank you for this opportunity.
Well, I'm excited to getting into it. Your book is right up our alley.
What is the main focus of the episode and why do rewards matter for kids?
And I'm gonna just say a disclaimer that this is the first interview I'm doing for my fall season. So I'm feeling a little rusty. So listeners, if I stumble over my words, that's why. Give me a little bit of a break here. But when I heard about your book. Which is called the reward trap, why rewards backfire and the real science of motivating your kids. It was such an easy yes for me to say, like, yes, we need to talk with you because these are motivation, how to handle rewards, if we should be using them at all, what does the science say about motivation? All of those things are so important to my community. So I've already read your formal bio, but will you just take a few minutes to talk about why this topic is such kind of a draw for you?
What is your personal stake in this conversation?
Oh yeah, it's very personal. The title says motivating kids, right? But reward is more than that. It not only affects motivation, but also it affects self esteem and your personality, how you grow up to be. This is why it is personal. Like I was always successful in my school, like academic life. I ranked fifty-sixth among one million students. I got into top college. I graduated as a valedictorian. Then I got Fulbright Scholarship. I got into Harvard and I had a perfect GPA. I did my PhD at the University of Cambridge, UK. And then I spent one year at MIT. then I won international awards. So I was very successful. Then I finished my PhD. I start to work in my professional life. Then everything's perfect, but I felt a little bit anxious.
And I didn't know why I was anxious. I couldn't name it. I started to think about it and then I found it. I am dependent on success and I can't be happy unless I am successful. In school life, it's very easy for me. You got a good grade, you feel successful, but in life it's nothing like this. Even if you see yourself successful in real life, others may not agree. So I said, wow. What am I gonna do? Why am I so dependent on external motivation or external validation? Then I ask myself, why did I grow Up like this. Then it all went back to childhood.
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Chapters
5 chapters
1
What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
0:00–2:07
2
What is the main focus of the episode and why do rewards matter for kids?
2:07–7:36
3
Why does Dr. Bolat consider his own academic success a personal stake in the reward debate?
7:36–22:21
4
How does the book define a reward and why is conditional praise problematic?
22:21–29:45
5
What scientific studies show that rewards undermine intrinsic motivation over time?
29:45–39:25
Speakers
1 identifiedMore from Full-Tilt Parenting: Strategies, Insights, and Connection for Parents Raising Neurodivergent Children
TPP 266a: A Conversation with Poet and Advocate LeDerick Horne
TPP 522: A Whole Child Approach to ADHD with Phil Boucher, M.D.
TPP 091a: A Conversation With Steve Silberman About His Book “Neurotribes”
TPP 521: A Conversation with Dr. Peter Gray About Restoring Childhood
TPP 253a: Advocate and Author Jonathan Mooney on Why Normal Sucks
TPP 519: Brendan Mahan on Overcoming the Wall of Awful