Is Russia a Fascist State? (Part 1)
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What is the historical context behind Russia’s claim of “denazification” of Ukraine?
Hi everyone, based here in Kyiv, Ukraine. My name is Mark Naknamy, co-founder and co-owner of UBN Network, and host of this podcast, History of the Making: The War in Ukraine. Denazification of Ukraine has been used as a justification of this war in Ukraine by Putin, really since the start of this full scale invasion in February 2022. It's quite a critical move, really, because it was a masterful move by Putin and by the Russian propaganda machine as it succeeded in getting the Russian population quickly behind this war, with quite strong support and relatively resilient support for years, attacking their brotherly nation and the Ukrainians and feeling justified to do so. Putin successfully tapped into sort of Russia's sense of heroism into the glory in defeating the original German Nazis.
I Falsely but castigating Ukrainians in the same light as Russia's greatest enemy in living memory in the German Nazis. And this is how Putin succeeded in getting high popular support for this war and for himself. So now while this is a complete lie, as we have discussed actually earlier with my guest here, Dr. Kras Kuzio, in an earlier podcast back in February of this year, in reality we really should be looking at Putin's Russia if we want to look for the true Nazis and the real fascism. So that's what we're going to be doing here today, discussing whether Russia is in fact a fascist state or not. So to do that, very happy to be welcoming back to the show Dr. Taras Kuzio, who, as mentioned, we did a podcast on the Ukrainian side of things, the allegations of Ukrainian being a Nazi state or Ukrainian population being filled with Nazis.
And he today is joined by Dr. Ian Garner, who is also a prominent British. born historian and specialist in particular in Russian war propaganda and military culture with a particular focus on the indoctrination of Russia's youth. So Dr. Kuzio and Dr. Garner, welcome to the show.
Thank you for inviting us.
Likewise.
Yeah.
Please to be.
Great, thank you for joining. You guys are the right people to be speaking about, considering you've written extensively on this particular issue, so that's why I wanted you on the show, of course. Doctor Garner, if I didn't give your background justice, as you haven't been on the show before, please do feel free to just add a bit more color to your background to introduce yourself to listeners.
Oh god, this is the bit I hate where I blow my own trumpet. But broadly speaking, I've been working for many years on How
How do Dr. Taras Kuzio and Dr. Ian Garner define fascism in modern Russia?
Russian soldiers, military identity and War culture is grown up around propaganda. Both in the 20th century and more recently, in particular using digital tools and social media. And that's something we're going to be talking about a lot today. So my last book, and I hope we'll get to the touch on this, was about militarization of children in today's Russia and how they get roped into to the army and supporting the military in various ways, and in particular how social media is so important for the state to achieve that.
Good. And that's where I think we'll we'll be heading with my first question to the both of you here. Because when we s as it's understood in the popular consciousness, when we say fascism, everyone of course always thinks of Germany and Hitler and Italy and Mussolini in the nineteen thirties and forties. So when people say Russia is a fascist nation, it's one of these annoying historical analogies of, oh, well, you just throw out the Nazi word and then it it just seems like an emotional outburst, right? But aside from that, holding that part aside, more academically, looking at this as a political description, do you believe Russia is a fascist state? And that's for either of you to start off with.
Yes, but I think I Ian can maybe take it on from here. Obviously we both do because we wouldn't have published an edited collection of ten authors or so that agree with us. But I think both Ian and myself were provoked in this direction, if that's the right word, not only by Russian policies in Ukraine since two thousand twenty two, but particularly and we wrote a joint chapter in the book on this subject.
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Chapters
8 chapters
1
What is the historical context behind Russia’s claim of “denazification” of Ukraine?
0:09–2:35
2
How do Dr. Taras Kuzio and Dr. Ian Garner define fascism in modern Russia?
2:35–10:24
3
Why is Mariupol presented as a key example of Russia’s fascist rhetoric and policy?
10:24–17:14
4
What role does Russian war propaganda and youth indoctrination play in the fascist narrative?
17:14–21:19
5
Which events between 2009‑2012 marked the turning point toward a fascist‑type regime?
21:19–26:30
6
How did the 2014‑2022 period accelerate Russia’s shift to authoritarian‑fascist governance?
26:30–31:24
7
What constitutional and institutional changes cemented Putin’s de‑facto fascist rule?
31:24–35:26
8
What are the main arguments against labeling Russia a fascist state and how might they be addressed?
35:26–40:27
Speakers
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