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The Walkers: The real Salt Path | Tortoise Investigates

The Miracle | The Walkers Ep4

27 Jan 2026

Transcription

Chapter 1: What rare condition is Moth diagnosed with and how does it affect him?

4.891 - 26.794 Moth

the observer. Moth, I have to tell you this. This is so important. I've been researching CBD, looking for the answer to why you were so well when we were walking and why you're deteriorating so quickly now.

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26.834 - 52.262 Chloe Hadjimotheou

It's the summer of 2015 in Rainer Wynne's second book, The Wild Silence. The couple are living in the Cornish coastal town of Polruin and Moth's been studying horticulture at university. But the sedentary lifestyle means his health is getting worse. The neurological condition he has means his memory's going and he's losing weight and limping.

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53.187 - 64.867 Chloe Hadjimotheou

In desperation, Rainer starts digging into medical papers, trying to understand why moths' health was so much better when they took their massive walk along the southwest coastal path the previous year.

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65.668 - 91.058 Moth

I showed him the research and made him read about patients with Alzheimer's who had undergone endurance training and had miraculously regained some cognitive abilities, which doctors had believed were lost forever. Don't you see? That's what the path was for us. Extreme endurance training. We were walking miles every day, carrying heavy weights on a really restricted diet. It's the same thing.

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93.468 - 110.854 Chloe Hadjimotheou

Moth has CBD, not Alzheimer's, but both illnesses involve a build-up of protein in the brain, so Rainer thinks this study must be relevant. Then she tells Moth about another paper that shows that plants release chemicals that have a positive effect on humans.

111.435 - 114.94 Moth

Surely this proves it, proves what I've always believed.

Chapter 2: What role does Rainer play in Moth's health journey?

115.721 - 127.585 Moth

We need the plants, the land, the natural world. We actually physically need it. I'm convinced it's part of the answer to why your health was so much better while you were walking. It has to be.

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127.625 - 162.024 Chloe Hadjimotheou

The Salt Path isn't just a memoir about a difficult time in Moth and Rainer's lives. It's about how grit and perseverance, coupled with true love and nature, is a recipe that revives the dying moth in a way that modern medicine can't. It's about a secular miracle. These are Rainer Wynne's books, but in many ways it's Moth's story. And yet Moth is largely absent from all the publicity.

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162.665 - 189.2 Chloe Hadjimotheou

Rainer's headlined so many literary festivals, been on dozens of chat show sofas and countless podcasts. And Moth has only done a handful of media appearances. Of course, that's understandable given his terminal neurodegenerative illness. But when he does appear in public, he's not camera shy. Here he is on Channel 5 at Hay Farm, talking about why most cider apples aren't good to eat.

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190.022 - 204.526 Moth

It's very dry. Very, very bitter. I love the American term for cider apple trees. and that they're spitters. And forgive me, it's... It really is unpleasant.

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205.527 - 215.381 Chloe Hadjimotheou

Elsewhere, he's appeared on the red carpet with Jason Isaacs and beamed into the one show with his own video message for the actor who played him in the Hollywood movie of his life.

215.861 - 234.42 Moth

Jason... I just wanted to say what a pleasure it has been meeting you and an absolute honour to see you portray me, me of all people. Thank you. It's not up to Jason's standard, is it?

234.44 - 244.57 Chloe Hadjimotheou

There's also this video I found online before I released my investigation. It was made by a charity called the PSPA that represents people with CBD.

247.351 - 273.342 Moth

This whole CBD journey started with just an aching shoulder. I thought I'd just pulled a muscle. I didn't realise at the time that I was also gaining a limp. It affects every moment of my waking day. It feels like somebody's moved into my body. This presence, if I dare call it that, is very cold. This is so tiring.

275.87 - 299.886 Chloe Hadjimotheou

The Salt Path has been read by millions of people. Millions more have watched the film. That's a lot of people being told that if you're dying and you simply try hard enough, if you're prepared to push beyond what you think you can endure, and if you really connect with nature, then you can cure the incurable.

Chapter 3: How does extreme endurance training relate to Moth's condition?

368.511 - 372.516 Chloe Hadjimotheou

If we're going to talk about walkers, well, John Todd's a walker.

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372.85 - 384.784 John Todd

And so walking was my sort of mode of getting anywhere and I found that I was having pains in my legs.

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385.264 - 409.29 Chloe Hadjimotheou

Or rather, he used to be a walker. These days he walks very slowly with the help of a stick. Watching him, it's hard to see the man he once was, but I've been chatting to him for months and I've got to know a warm, witty man with a dry sense of humour. I first visited him at his home near Aldershot last summer and this time round, several months later, I can see a difference.

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410.031 - 431.511 Chloe Hadjimotheou

He's more hesitant when we speak and he takes longer to find the words he wants to say. Just so you know, we've decided to edit his answers slightly for brevity. So a few years back, through the haze of lockdown, he wasn't feeling well. Even after he'd recovered from Covid, something just wasn't quite right.

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432.419 - 468.754 John Todd

I started to have balance problems and I don't mean just when I came home from the pub, I mean sort of there were times where I would just feel unsteady on my feet. I had a lot of problems in my left hand which I didn't really understand why I hadn't injured it I was struggling to make a fist or just inflexible The doctor guessed he must have hurt it somehow

469.493 - 484.327 John Todd

They thought it would be a physical type problem. So physiotherapy on the hand was there. They arranged for me.

485.169 - 488.937 Chloe Hadjimotheou

But it didn't help. He was continuing to deteriorate.

489.541 - 502.998 John Todd

They had another look at it. I had a scan. I was told eventually that it was Parkinson's.

503.018 - 518.839 Chloe Hadjimotheou

For most people, finding out you have Parkinson's would be pretty devastating. But John's quite a stoic guy. A few years before all this, he actually discovered he has autism, which really helped explain why he hasn't always found things easy.

Chapter 4: What evidence suggests a connection between nature and health?

607.683 - 633.032 Chloe Hadjimotheou

John had corticobasal degeneration, or CBD for short, the same condition Moth was diagnosed with in the salt path. It's rare. It only affects roughly one in 100,000 people, and it's fatal. John's doctor, Dr. Gratwick, is one of the UK's top specialists in CBD. People are referred to him when, like John, doctors can't work out what else might be wrong with them.

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633.012 - 657.703 Chloe Hadjimotheou

Even so, in his 20-odd years of practice, he's probably only seen around 30 people with the condition. He says most neurologists might only encounter one or two cases in their entire career. What's interesting is when Dr. Gratwick has to break the news about CBD to someone like John, he doesn't use euphemisms or try and soften the blow. He's incredibly direct.

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658.122 - 671.77 John Todd

He explained that it was an incurable condition. There was no medication. And I think he did give me an idea of life expectancy.

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671.991 - 677.582 Dr. James Gratwick

I'm afraid that the life expectancy for corticobasal syndrome is around five years to eight years.

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678.052 - 708.521 John Todd

I remember at one point I said, so this is going to kill me then? And he said, oh no. He said, it won't kill you. Excuse me, I know I'm a bit dense at times, but why have I got life expectancy if it's not going to kill me? He said, the most likely cause of death would be something like choking on, because you'll lose the ability to swallow, or pneumonia.

709.283 - 728.212 Dr. James Gratwick

Eventually, the muscles of swallowing will become like that, and then you can't swallow. And there's two elements to that. One, you can't feed. So it becomes questions about do we need to place feeding tubes through the stomach to feed people? But even around that, if there's difficulty swallowing your own saliva, then you can swallow it quite easily into your lungs.

729.453 - 735.462 Dr. James Gratwick

If that does happen, it can very quickly lead to pneumonia. And that is the primary cause of death, usually in corticobasal syndrome.

736.163 - 744.374 Chloe Hadjimotheou

It's a tragically fast and cruel disease. All things considered, John took the news pretty well.

744.955 - 753.314 John Todd

I'll be honest. a lot of me was actually relieved that I had a reason for what was going on.

Chapter 5: What challenges does Moth face in public appearances?

854.793 - 858.52 John Todd

I guess I didn't know what to believe anymore.

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863.57 - 882.608 Chloe Hadjimotheou

Back in the world of Rainer Wynne's books, it's 2019 and Moth's been getting gradually sicker and sicker. The sedentary lifestyle in Cornwall is hurting him. But then, that summer, the couple plan a walking holiday in Iceland. And before long, Raina's struggling to keep up with him.

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883.85 - 907.133 Moth

In the cold wind, blowing salt-laden air from the sea, no doubts remained. No drugs or doctors could help Moth, but he didn't need them. Simply by living as he was built to, his body had found a way to sidestep the failures and go on. Moth was surviving by returning to a more natural state of existence.

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911.416 - 940.199 Chloe Hadjimotheou

But when the walk's over, they can't sustain his health. It's the same pattern being repeated in all her books. Moths ill, they walk, he recovers. He keeps yo-yoing in and out of wellness. And then in her third book, she becomes even more categorical about the medical miracle. Landlines opens on Moth in crisis. They've been living on Hay Farm and his health's worse than ever.

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940.941 - 946.553 Chloe Hadjimotheou

He's falling over and suffering incontinence. They go to the doctor and it's bad news.

948.743 - 975.966 Moth

Moth's scan showed that he has a distinct reduction in his receptor cells, which show up as lights on the screen. His lights were undoubtedly going out. Since walking the coast path, doctors, physiotherapists and neurologists have contacted us suggesting reasons why his health improved as it did. So it could be argued that what Moth undertook on that very long walk was an extreme form of physio.

977.077 - 1001.548 Moth

Or maybe it was the very low calorie diet we survived on because we couldn't afford to eat. Or the time spent in nature. Or any number of other reasons that have yet to be considered. What was without question was the speed with which his health deteriorated when he returned to a more sedentary life. All the old symptoms returning more aggressively than before.

1002.625 - 1026.186 Chloe Hadjimotheou

Raina's love for him won't allow her to accept his inevitable death. She persuades him to go on one last hike, this time from Scotland all the way down to Cornwall. It's their toughest walk yet, but it's worth it because when they visit the doctor again and have another brain scan, they get a totally different picture.

1027.246 - 1038.38 Moth

What we're seeing are two sets of results. The old DAT scan, showing an abnormal reading, and this, the new one, showing a normal reading.

Chapter 6: How does Moth's health fluctuate after their walking adventures?

1573.781 - 1575.045 Chloe Hadjimotheou

Do medical miracles happen?

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1576.088 - 1605.344 Dr. James Gratwick

No, it is dangerous to, with a condition which is as severe as this, promote an idea that strenuous exercise could reverse or cure it on two grounds really. One, because it won't and if anything it'll be detrimental to the patient's health to attempt to do so and they will suffer from it. But secondly as well, it will it will have a huge psychological impact upon them.

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1605.364 - 1620.878 Dr. James Gratwick

And it can make a patient feel that they have, in some way, that they are responsible for their condition. And for its worsening, it's because they have not done enough. And that would be wrong, because it is no fault of the patient whatsoever.

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1623.946 - 1637.566 Chloe Hadjimotheou

Over the last six months, lots of people have written to me to tell me about their experiences with CBD. One woman told me that as she read my article in The Observer questioning Moth's condition, relief washed over her.

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1638.207 - 1653.008 Chloe Hadjimotheou

Because for years after reading The Salt Path, she wondered whether she could have kept her sick mother alive longer if she'd forced her to walk the coastal path, even though she knew deep down that her mother who had CBD could never have done it.

1653.933 - 1667.17 Chris Pleasby

I used to walk the fells. And what I said, one of my favourite walks was the South West Coastal Path, which they now seem to call the Salt Path.

1668.252 - 1682.571 Chloe Hadjimotheou

Chris Pleasby was diagnosed with CBD in 2022. He's gone from being an avid hiker to struggling to get to the end of his garden. I mean, I guess for you, it was so obvious that it couldn't be true. Oh gosh, yeah.

1682.991 - 1702.653 Chris Pleasby

Oh gosh, yeah. blindingly often. As far as their walking, swimming, I can't swim anymore. I haven't got the coordination. I was a good swimmer. My wife has to do my laces, my wife has to do buttons.

1703.514 - 1708.1 Chloe Hadjimotheou

But for Chris, this illness isn't a fate he has to passively accept.

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