Chapter 1: What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
This is the Dan Levatar Show with the Stugatz Podcast.
It's a sad and scary time in America. You will forgive me for the gloom of what it is we're about to talk about. We will get back to the silliness of sports and other things in a second. Senator Mark Kelly, he's a former U.S. Navy combat pilot. He's an astronaut. He's now the senator for Arizona. Thank you for joining us, Senator.
What was your immediate reaction upon hearing the news yesterday that conservative activist Charlie Kirk was shot and killed in front of a crowd in Utah?
Well, I was horrified, as I think most Americans were and should be in this political violence like this, you know, has no place. in our society, and it really demonstrates kind of the worst of us. We've seen this kind of, you know, violence on both sides.
We saw what happened to Melissa Hortman and a couple of months ago and her husband in Minnesota killed what happened to my wife, Gabby Giffords, you know, shot in the head in 2011. So we see this over and over again. And, you know, to me lately, I mean, the thing that
You know immediately comes to mind is the horrible situation that his wife and kids and parents and siblings You know now find themselves in you know, I've had you know, sort of that experience my wife in 2011 she survived She's got you know serious and significant disability because of it We shouldn't have you know this in our country happened over and over and over again and How do we stop it?
How do we stop it? I think that this is a combination of some factors, I think, that brought us here. Certainly, on one side, it's just how divided we've become politically. I also think that there is just easy access to firearms. We have a very high rate of gun violence in general. Over 100,000 people are shot and killed.
every year in our country we are like no other developed you know country uh in the world when it comes to when it comes to gun violence um so how do we stop it i mean we could strengthen our gun laws we could also try to find opportunities to just bring us together
You know, I serve in the United States Senate as a Democrat, and, you know, I've got strong relationship relationships with my Republican colleagues. I think the I think the general public just thinks it's actually more maybe more contentious and divisive than it actually is in Washington. The media, I'm not saying you guys, but the media often highlights negativity.
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Chapter 2: What was Senator Mark Kelly's reaction to Charlie Kirk's killing?
I think this is one of those times.
That all sounds good, but it doesn't sound much like a solution. And I know we have these conversations every time, but it seems like we've lost our sense of humanity in this landscape. So I'm sure you noticed, right, that the conversation immediately goes to gun laws and then politics. Just take a side and blame another side and the humanity gets lost in there somewhere.
Well, I think it's fair to blame both sides. I mean, that that is the reality of the situation we live in. And I also think it's shortsighted to ignore gun laws, you know, in our country. I mean, we've got You know, weak gun laws. We have high rates of gun crime. Those things are clearly connected. You look around the country and, you know, states that have stronger laws have less gun violence.
You know, that's that's clear. I think at this moment, what we should be thinking about is Charlie Kirk's family. And, you know, his wife, his children, he's got a three year old and a one year old that are going to grow up without their dad. And that's just horrible. But if you want to get to, you know, how do we prevent, you know, future, you know, acts like this?
We have to find a way to unite. this country we've got to have leaders that are really willing to you know step out there and you know say this isn't who we are uh and not like vilify uh democrats or republicans that does often happen. And I've seen it. You know, I saw it in 2011 when Gabby got shot. And I, you know, see it over and over and over again.
But I could tell you this, if we don't work to, you know, try to fix this, this could get a lot worse. I think we're at a
a moment in our country's history a lot like it was in the 1960s how divided we were then and you saw rising political assassinations and this was a political assassination i mean we don't know the exact motivation of this person and we don't know how he got the gun or who he was yet uh i think we will find out those things out but i think it's clearly that this was political
To that extent, though, the manhunt for his killer, for Charlie Kirk's killer, is still underway after two suspects were previously taken under custody and released. How does that happen?
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Chapter 3: What personal experiences does Senator Kelly share regarding gun violence?
How is that possible?
Well, you know, I'm the son of two cops. You know, these things are challenging. I've also lived through this with, you know, my wife and investigation and, you know, her assailant or the guy that, you know, did this and killed six individuals was apprehended at the scene. This is different. It's complicated.
You know, the FBI and law enforcement took these two individuals into custody, questioned them, released them. I could see how that could happen. You know, when they have a suspect, they you know, they should be taking those kind of steps. I don't give I don't fault them, you know, in any way for that. You're going to see the full force of the FBI and federal law enforcement put on this.
And I'm confident that we will apprehend this individual.
Senator, I know you mentioned that we fear that it could get worse. I feel like we crossed that Rubicon already. Most politically motivated attacks. There's a disassociation between us and the act of violence, but the video and the person representing a movement has changed this, but also... These things are typically messier. Multiple shots, a manifesto of some sort, a trace, a suspect, eyes.
We're usually further along on this. This seems like a professional hit, so I feel like we crossed that. This is the scary territory, I think, that you alluded to, sir.
yeah well and that's one of the reasons why you know folks in like my position and house members and governors you need to you know take a step back and see how you know what should we be doing at this point you know i'm trying to get out there and you know speak about this and you know what i think is a responsible way you know we're not you know pointing fingers here um but also recognizing that we have a problem
um and you know the problem is politicization and you you know just the kind of rhetoric you know that people use today and i think it's uh i think it's gotten worse over time and i've you know seen this from both democrats and republicans and um you know we've got to figure out a way through this and but we also can't ignore it um you know on this individual event
Yeah, you know, I think the FBI is going to figure this out and not none of these are exactly the same and they've got a hard job ahead of them. But I have confidence in the FBI and local law enforcement there that they will they will handle this appropriately.
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Chapter 4: How does Senator Kelly suggest we address political violence?
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Chapter 5: What are the implications of political division on violence in America?
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Trump addressed the news from the Oval Office. He expressed his admiration for Kirk while blaming the radical left political violence. How should people feel when we hear President Trump alluding to potentially going after organizations he views in opposition to him as a result of yesterday's murder?
Not good. I don't think people should feel good about that. I, you know, I think in our country's history, you know, every president has looked at when things like this happen, they look at it as an opportunity to unite us, to bring us together, not divide us. You know, I didn't agree with Charlie Kirk on most things, but I also recognize, you know, that he is a human being. He has a family.
He has every right to be there on a college campus expressing his views. You know, I defended the Constitution flying in combat in the first Gulf War. I would do it again to protect his right and people like him. But I, you know, I didn't didn't agree with him. But what I saw yesterday from the president, I hope I see something else today. This is the anniversary of 9-11.
This is also an opportunity to try to find some common ground among all Americans. and try to find a way, you know, to kind of, you know, push us together in our humanity, but to turn down the temperature. I didn't see that yesterday from him. I do understand that the president knew Charlie Kirk personally and was very fond of him. So I'll give him a little bit of a pass for yesterday.
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Chapter 6: How does the media contribute to the narrative of political violence?
And I get that. And this is a very challenging time for them. You know, I've been through this before, you know, with my wife, Gabby, being shot in the head and in the hospital for six months and then a recovery and being in the middle of this shit storm that you find yourself in, that his family has now found itself in through no fault of their own. Uh,
And, you know, I've got probably dozens of Republican colleagues who are friends of mine that were friends with Charlie Kerr. And they're mourning this loss. And I feel for them.
You believe in this country. You believe in this country's ideals. I imagine that you're a hopeful person. Have you felt as hopeless? as you have over the last couple of years, the threats to our country from every side?
Hey, I am never a hopeless person. Like, I am an optimist, right? I look at the strengths of our country are much more powerful than our shortcomings. And I think the future of our country is great. We are the most generous, innovative country in the world. And I think we have a bright future. I think we do go through historically.
We've seen other times in our country's history where we've had, you know, very difficult and challenging times. And I do think we're going to get through this. I think we've got to all recognize that it's not going to be easy and we've got to work at it. But, you know, for in my job, you know, I sit on the Armed Services and the Intelligence Committee.
I, you know, I see the threats out there just as a nation, not just internal, right? External threats all the time, every week. the challenges, you know, that we, you know, face from from our adversaries. And I worry about it a lot, but I don't get to the point where it ever seems hopeless to me.
Let me ask it a different way than the amount of despair that you feel at the moment, the threat to democracy, our country and its ideals. You have felt this way, the way that you have over the last five or six years. You've had things happen to you. You've seen everything that's happening. Is this time more perilous to you? Does it feel more perilous than previous times?
I think this feels, you know, pretty awful. You know, it's a horrible thing that happened. And, you know, I see how some people could feel, you know, despair. I don't feel despair, you know, over over this. I, you know, certainly, you know, sad about it, what happened to him and his family and our political system. And this is, you know, this hurts and it's damaging, damaging to us as a country.
I also think we can find our way out of it.
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Chapter 7: What is Senator Kelly's stance on the role of gun laws in preventing violence?
Gretchen Whitmer in Michigan, nearly kidnapped the president of the United States, you know, Republican president tried to kill him twice. You know, we see this, you know, this isn't unique to, you know, one party or the other. I mean, we see this across the political spectrum. There are bad people out there, you know, that just want to, you know, wreak havoc and murder people.
so i understand when things like this happen and people are very upset that they're going to say things i get that um you know give give this a couple days and i think people will you know calm down and we can really start thinking about some solutions
Senator, I thank you for your time. This is obviously somber subject matter. I don't know how to transition from this into the other things that we do, so I'm hoping you can help me. Do you have a favorite football allegiance of some sort? Do you have a strong football opinion of some sort? Something you can give me to somehow try and transition out of what it is that we're presently doing.
What?
Maybe break? Well, I could break, or I could just include him in the fun of sports because everyone's a football fan.
Maybe a little wrap-up? You're absolutely right. I am a football fan. I'll be watching. I've got to travel tonight, but I'll be... you know, watching the commanders playing the Packers prediction commanders. Absolutely. I know the plus three must've heard against this. I know that.
I know the, I know the Packers, you know, have quite the team, but you know, I I'm going with the commanders Cardinals, obviously by allegiance. I think they either they've had a good start to the season. I'm optimistic. Yeah. I also have to say, just watching the Minnesota Bears game, not a big fan of Minnesota. I was really impressed with his quarterback, especially in that last quarter.
That's good. That's good stuff. I think that guy really has a future.
Thank you, Senator. Tony doesn't believe in Kyler Murray. Senator, are you tired of Kyler Murray? I'm tired of him. No, you can't be tired. I am not tired of him.
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Chapter 8: How does Senator Kelly view the response from political leaders after violence?
In week two, you're sniffing a who's who game? No.
In week two. We sussed it out.
Keep up. You're sniffing around. I heard who's who. No, no, no.
Contenders and pretenders.
Separating. No, that's where you ended up. You started by sniffing who's who. I can't work things out with my fellas. It's not a who. You've got to be respectful of the Cathedral of Who's Who's game. That's not week two. We were. We were. We said it was not. You have to ask the question. You have to ask the question.
You're judging spitballs, and that's not what you do. You don't even want us to ask the question. Yeah.
If you're going to sniff around, who's who? Because you volunteered, and I wasn't ready for who's who. That's a December conversation.
Agreed, it's a little bit later. This is the difference between forced him to fly across the country, and he was already across the country. It's a classic mix-up. You guys don't mix it up.
I'm going to separate you guys.
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