Tucker & Piers Morgan Debate Foreign Aid, Hate Speech, NATO, Gun Control, & Is Zelensky a Dictator?
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Here's Morgan. Thank you. Sorry. Telling off-color jokes off-camera. Thank you so much. No, my pleasure. We are in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia. We are. I'm not even going to ask you how you wound up here, but I'm glad to see you.
Well, we're both here for the same reason, actually.
We've both gone into the oil business. Yes. I never, yeah. So I want to ask you, I want to start just on a very hostile note, okay? Because I feel like that's a good way to frame it. Good, good. Let's start having me to continue. Zelensky is a hero. How could you say that?
I don't agree with you about him or Ukraine. I went to interview him in Kyiv. And he's an extraordinary story, obviously, this comedian who becomes president, having played a comedian who was a president in a comedy show, right? And I've seen what you said about it. I mean, what's interesting to me on a bigger picture about Ukraine, Russia, your views, a lot of conservative views in America, is that 30 years ago, there would have been no element of resistance from the conservative side about taking on a Russian dictator who'd invaded a European country. I know it's a lot more complicated. I know the history, but a lot of very smart people on, a lot of people you've interviewed. And, you know, I do learn a lot each time I talk about all the history, obviously. My brother was a British army colonel. My sister married a British army colonel. They've all engaged in conflicts around the world. And so it's complicated.
There's no doubt that on the Russian side, they believe they were provoked into doing this. I know that you have sympathy with that view. There's also no doubt from the Ukrainian side that they believe since the 90s they've been this sovereign democratic country, albeit not perfect. You think deeply flawed. I think they've been imperfect, trying to improve. And Zelensky has actually, I think, been a force for good, not bad. But ultimately, what's happened now... is that you have a situation where, as Donald Trump told me recently, it's just the mowing fields now, where you have thousands of young men being killed, often on a daily basis, both sides. And no one's winning this war, it seems to me.
And if anyone is going to win it, it's likely to be Russia, not Ukraine. And then what happens? And that concerns me enormously. If the West allows Putin... to just take the land he's taken what guarantee do we have he won't try and take the rest of Ukraine he took Crimea he's back for more I think he wants the whole of Ukraine I think he won't stop there if he's allowed to get it I think he's a pretty ruthless evil Russian dictator um how are we defining just to find the term so we can follow the same yeah what's a dictator A dictator to me is somebody, well, I would start by saying you have no respect for democratic norms, a free and fair election.
So like an unelected leader would be a dictator?
Well, you wouldn't argue that Putin, for example, has free and fair elections.
No, I'm not that interested, actually. Are you not? Not really. It's not my country. I'm interested in my leaders, whether they have the consent of their people. It's not of great interest to me. I do think Putin's way more popular than Joe Biden. To his people? Yes. More popular in Russia than Biden was ever popular. I wouldn't dispute that. Why are you so against Zelenskyy? No, I'm just trying to understand when you dismiss Putin as a dictator, which is totally fair, I guess, but I'm just trying to understand what you mean by dictator. So the first criterion for dictatorship is that you're not elected. And what else? Because Zelensky's obviously not elected either. Yeah. So I'm just trying to kind of figure out what you're talking about.
Well, your comparison with Zelensky and Putin over the last two years, I found baffling. Because you seem to think there's some moral equivalence between the two. And Zelensky hasn't illegally invaded another country. Right. Do you not have a problem with what Putin's done?
Hold on. I just want to know what a dictator is. I just want to know. I mean, maybe he's a better guy than Putin or whatever. And you could say some things about one or nothing. But if we're just going to define dictator, the first feature of a dictator is he's not elected. So Zelensky's not elected. He's also, well, he's banned a religious denomination. He's murdered his political opponents.
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