Andrea Dunlop

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I think one of the ways that they construct these stories is that they make it sound simultaneously.

They sort of collapse the entire process of getting criminal charges or a child removal.

They collapse that all into this one moment when a doctor is making the diagnosis.

And they do this thing where they both...

They make it sort of like this double-edged sword where if a doctor, if a conviction goes through or if charges go through or if something happens, that's evidence of the doctor having too much power.

However, if there's any challenges to her along the way, then that's evidence that she got it wrong.

So it just completely negates everything that goes into

actually having any kind of action from the court on a child abuse case, which is not just based on a doctor's diagnosis and also like something not going through charges is not evidence that that doctor got it wrong.

Can you just kind of talk us through this willful misunderstanding of the process that's being put forth in these media?

I don't really buy Serial's explanation that this series is meant to be only about Dr. Jensen and not all caps, mainly because Neri broadens the scope to include all caps as she lands her closing argument in the third episode.

But even if we take them at their word that this is just about Dr. Jensen, I wanted to ask Randy if they made a case for that.

Is there anything in particular that Deborah Jensen does that is outside of the standard of care for child abuse pediatricians, that's where she goes way outside her lane?

I mean, do you, is there anything that you've seen that would substantiate that as someone who's known and worked with her?